Issues with my 1939 Plymouth

[T120]

To illustrate the comment I made....There should be no physical contact between  A and B on this drawing. Also the spring connection on to the movable contact in your distributor photo appears it may be touching the jumper (B) as well

 

Edited February 5, 2021 by T120

[Frank Elder]

Beautiful Vert.
Wow you guys knocked it out of the park! Good job, may I also add that after the wires are either routed properly or replaced you may still not fire due to the junky chinese capacitors that are being sold these days.

Edited February 5, 2021 by Frank Elder

[Merle Coggins]

12 hours ago, T120 said:

Further to what keith just said, I enlarged the photo you posted  of your distributor innards ,it appears to me that the points will never show open, ( spark occurs when they open),because there appears to be a short circuit where that condenser is attached to the movable contact and the jumper wire (stationary contact)...Which is chassis ground.

 

I thought that too when I studied the photo. But I believe it's just a perspective thing due to the angle the photo was taken from. 

[Pete]

Hi Paul,

 

It appears that distributor is not original to the car. In your pic I think I see an oil cup used to lube the distributor shaft. The original '39 Auto-Lite distributor had a grease cup there. I know they went to the oil cup by '42. Not sure about '40 & '41.

 

Pete

 

[John Reddie]

17 hours ago, Paul Roa said:

 

Thanks Pete for posting the pics of your swell Plymouth convertible. I have never seen a center front bumper guard like the one you have. It's pretty neat looking.

John R

[John Reddie]

Paul, I called you Pete in the previous post. My apology.

John R

[sidevalvepete]

4 hours ago, Frank Elder said:

Beautiful Vert.
Wow you guys knocked it out of the park! Good job, may I also add that after the wires are either routed properly or replaced you may still not fire due to the junky chinese capacitors that are being sold these days.

I agree with you Frank. It's like a bunch of friendly, knowledgeable old car folks turned up in your shed to help you through an issue that has you stumped. Love it! You are all a great bunch of people. Long may it continue. ???

[desoto1939]

All condensers are the same but the difference is the length of the wire coming out of the condenser the  mounting bracket and the type of connector  on the end of the wire.

 

I have the Autolite catalog and it shows pictures of the various condensers and it should the Autolite number and the length of the wire and then the connector end.

 

So this is important to know.  Also just because you have a specific model and year of a car does not mean that you can just go into a NAPA or good auto supply store and say I have a 39 Plymouth and expect them to sell you the correct parts for your dizzy.  Yes you might get the correct parts for the 39 Plyouth based on the books or computers information for a 39 Plymouth.  But over time things wear out and someone might have replaced the dizzy from another Plymouth from a later or earlier year.  If this has been done you will always need to know the model dizzy that you have  such as IGS-4102  or IGS-4102C  which is specific to my 39 Desoto  but if someone put in a different model then then internal pats might not work.

 

So you have to know the number that is stamped on the body of the dizzy to get the correct internal parts.

 

 

Rich Hartung

Desoto1939@aol.com

[T120]

25 minutes ago, desoto1939 said:

All condensers are the same but the difference is the length of the wire coming out of the condenser the  mounting bracket and the type of connector  on the end of the wire.

 

I have the Autolite catalog and it shows pictures of the various condensers and it should the Autolite number and the length of the wire and then the connector end.

 

So this is important to know.  Also just because you have a specific model and year of a car does not mean that you can just go into a NAPA or good auto supply store and say I have a 39 Plymouth and expect them to sell you the correct parts for your dizzy.  Yes you might get the correct parts for the 39 Plyouth based on the books or computers information for a 39 Plymouth.  But over time things wear out and someone might have replaced the dizzy from another Plymouth from a later or earlier year.  If this has been done you will always need to know the model dizzy that you have  such as IGS-4102  or IGS-4102C  which is specific to my 39 Desoto  but if someone put in a different model then then internal pats might not work.

 

So you have to know the number that is stamped on the body of the dizzy to get the correct internal parts.

 

 

Rich Hartung

Desoto1939@aol.com

Richard, Paul mentioned in his first post that the engine was replaced with a 1946 P15. I'm guessing the distributor was changed with the engine also. The distributor  I show for the Plymouth P 15 Is Auto Lite IGS -4207-1

[keithb7]

Speaking of condensers, my 1954 Motors Manual does a good job explaining the results of using improper condensers. Over capacity or under capacity, versus just-right. 
 

The condenser is very important as it plays a key role in coil saturation time and anti-arcing at the points. Sharp, quick, precise, electron flow-cut off makes for a stronger, crisper well-timed spark at the plug tip. As mentioned it also assists with a quicker recharge time of the coil. 3000 rpm engine speed at 55 mph means the coils gets nano-seconds to fully recharge.  Pretty important.
 

The condenser, sometimes an overlooked part that can easily make the difference between being stranded roadside or not. 

Edited February 5, 2021 by keithb7

[desoto1939]

3 hours ago, T120 said:

Richard, Paul mentioned in his first post that the engine was replaced with a 1946 P15. I'm guessing the distributor was changed with the engine also. The distributor  I show for the Plymouth P 15 Is Auto Lite IGS -4207-1

T120:  yes i noted that the engine was from another car. The point that I was trying to make was that if something has changed but you think it might have beenthe original engine and not real sure of the approprate electrical parts then you have to do some searching to make sure that you have replaced specific parts with the appropriate parts such as in this case the engine was s wapped and then old dizzy might have been used or the original might have been used.  So if the original wa used then asking for 1939 Plymouth parts would be correct but asking for a 1939 plymouth Dizzy internal parts might not work if the dizzy is from another year such as in this case.

 

Have to know what you are replacing the parts with and to be sure they care correct.

 

This mistake has happened to alot of car owners.

 

Rich Hartung

[Booger]

4 hours ago, desoto1939 said:

All condensers are the same but the difference is the length of the wire coming out of the condenser the  mounting bracket and the type of connector  on the end of the wire.

 

I have the Autolite catalog and it shows pictures of the various condensers and it should the Autolite number and the length of the wire and then the connector end.

 

So this is important to know.  Also just because you have a specific model and year of a car does not mean that you can just go into a NAPA or good auto supply store and say I have a 39 Plymouth and expect them to sell you the correct parts for your dizzy.  Yes you might get the correct parts for the 39 Plyouth based on the books or computers information for a 39 Plymouth.  But over time things wear out and someone might have replaced the dizzy from another Plymouth from a later or earlier year.  If this has been done you will always need to know the model dizzy that you have  such as IGS-4102  or IGS-4102C  which is specific to my 39 Desoto  but if someone put in a different model then then internal pats might not work.

 

So you have to know the number that is stamped on the body of the dizzy to get the correct internal parts.

 

 

Rich Hartung

Desoto1939@aol.com

something as simply as a condensor...been down that road

[Slickster]

With the key on, if you open the points, a spark should jump out of the center distributor wire, if the points are open, grounding the arm should also produce a spark, might help figure things out, nice car btw

[bobus8]

Congrats on the car Paul.  It's beautiful.  I noticed in the picture you posted that the ground wire with a sharp bend in the 11:00 position near the edge of the distributor housing could be broken internally.  Just something else for you to check.

[Dartgame]

Very nice Car !!!

 

I'll Add my 2 cents. Pull the distributor and disassemble it down the advance weights, clean and check for play in the dist shaft. If reasonable, proceed to lube and rebuild with new jumper wires, points, and condenser. I've had a brand new condenser go bad in less than 40 minutes of run time. Very irritating because it may still show spark, but not enough to start.

[Paul Roa]

thank you all for your WONDERFUL advice. well i took it to my friends shop, three heads are better than one. it seems that there were a few things wrong with this setup

1. as you all pointed out the points and condenser were grounded out and they were burnt and now replaced and gapped correctly

2. the spark plug cables were not properly set, by this i mean that the cables were bad and needed replacement

3. the coil wire that goes to distributor was not inserted all the way due to bad cables

4. coil replaced

5. the rotor and rotor cap were replaced , I HAD put it on backwards, my fault

6. the timing was way off, this was a big factor

7. the distributor was properly set and this car fires up like a champ

 

again thank you to all i did learn alot, my eyes are bad so i needed the extra help from my friend. 

[Frank Elder]

Wonderful.