Dual carb setup question

[Woodsy]

I have this dual carb setup that I believe is off an early 50 HD Dodge. Never seen one before. Imagine there'll be some folks on here with some info on them hopefully. TIA.

I've  attached a pic of my 34 Wrecker, totally unrelated to this question...

 

[47 dodge 1.5 ton]

Most Likely off a 265 truck motor. If you change your mind about ownership, I could use as my exhaust manifolds have some cracks.

[wallytoo]

3 hours ago, Woodsy said:

I have this dual carb setup that I believe is off an early 50 HD Dodge. Never seen one before. Imagine there'll be some folks on here with some info on them hopefully. TIA.

I've  attached a pic of my 34 Wrecker, totally unrelated to this question...

 

 

i don’t see a question, only a statement.

[Charlie Stephenson]

Woodsy,  your twin 25 Carb/Exhaust is the nicest one I've seen in my 5 year unsuccessful search for one of my own.  My Fresh 265 would be happy show them under the hood of my 1934 Plymouth PE Deluxe.  I have a empty wood shipping crate that I wood be willing to ship to you.  Inside the crate you would find a Freight allowed return label with a financial consideration of your liking for the assembly.  Would you report on the condition of the Heat riser Baffles to us?  Charlie Stephenson

2 hours ago, wallytoo said:

 

 

 Charlie Stephenson

[HotRodTractor]

As you can tell - that is a factory setup from 1954 or later that bolts onto the 25" long engines. They are highly sought after. It took me 10 years before I could purchase a setup, and I would purchase another set if given the opportunity. 

[47 dodge 1.5 ton]

Come on, who could possibly want (2) old, worn out Carter truck Ball & Ball carbs with all that sloppy linkage to keep managed, along with keeping gaskets tight, listening to (2) noisy tail pipes and having to avoid water puddles with the front right tire!!? Now —in exchange, you could have a late model Holley (2) barrel with an electric choke that according to some, makes up to 200hp (w/just carb) and maybe a special pop here and there! Enjoy your set-up! Kevin 

Edited November 10, 2020 by 47 dodge 1.5 ton

[Woodsy]

Thx for the replies. Unfortunately the manifold is cracked, so it's good looking from afar...

So it looks like from the replies it fits a 265. Is there a year range? And what size/models of truck?

Is there a web link that would take me to somewhere to read up on it...

Thx!

[HotRodTractor]

1 hour ago, Woodsy said:

Thx for the replies. Unfortunately the manifold is cracked, so it's good looking from afar...

So it looks like from the replies it fits a 265. Is there a year range? And what size/models of truck?

Is there a web link that would take me to somewhere to read up on it...

Thx!

 

It will physically fit on any 25" long engine - but came as optional equipment on 265 engines in 2-1/2T trucks. It was often ordered as spare parts and installed on 25" engines in cars and pickups. The first marketing literature I have seen with it is from 1954 - the same year as the hemi was introduced into those trucks. The hemi got most of 2 pages - the "economical inline 6" with dual carbs got a blurb and a picture in the corner.... it made more torque and hp than the hemi. Somewhere at some time I read that they were developed to meet the requirements for an order of Canadian snow plow trucks. I don't remember where I read that or if there is any truth to it, but it sticks in my mind. 

 

I'm not worried about cracks in them. They are well worth the time to repair. 

 

As far as a link to read up on them.... there isn't really anything that I know of. 

[47 dodge 1.5 ton]

I haven’t before heard mentioned about the Canadian plow trucks, neat information. Just wanted to add that it showed 136hp advertised with the dual carb/exhaust set up on the 265cu  motors. I have seen larger flathead dodge trucks with them as well, they look a little different. I almost bought one by mistake, they would not fit the 25” engines. Be very cautious to who does your welding on cast iron as there really is no weld procedures qualified for repetitive results (cast iron only has a tensile strength requirements and not chemistry for the elements per ASTM meaning it is not as controlled by different foundries, each one may have their own pour sheet requirements). Some people are just good at repairs, I would look for a well seasoned welder!

Edited November 11, 2020 by 47 dodge 1.5 ton

[DJ194950]

Before any repairs to cracks make sure that the flanges are flat!

Uneven surfaces from past repairs, over tightening, wrong washers and nuts cause these issues and can warp a manifold  quite badly. Been here and seen it!

 

The the manifold can be repaired by machining flat. Not sure myself if it should be before or after weld but my thoughts seem to lead me it should be after?

 

Just a re-weld without any checking will cause a quick repeat of a crack!

 

DJ

[47 dodge 1.5 ton]

The welding should be completed first, then machining as heat can cause things to warp. My recommendation is; clean, LP test (this will show all relevant linear cracks at the surface) pre-heat, weld,  controlling inter-pass temperature, LP, stress relieve, LP, machine all surfaces flat, spot face all holes, and LP again for verification. Repeat all steps if(when) manifold cracks during this process!

Edited November 11, 2020 by 47 dodge 1.5 ton

[DJ194950]

3 minutes ago, 47 dodge 1.5 ton said:

The welding should be completed first, then machining as heat can cause things to warp. My recommendation is; clean, LP test (this will show all relevant linear cracks at the surface) pre-heat, weld,  controlling inter-pass temperature, LP, stress relieve, LP, machine all surfaces flat, spot face all holes, and LP again for verification. Repeat all steps if(when) manifold cracks during this process!

 

Would you recommend using arc welding with cast iron rod or  "V" out cracks and preheat then braze?  I used to work for a welding teacher (in his past) that had the beast luck brazing mainly because he said to me that his not having a oven big enough for even preheat to weld and reheat afterward, plus have a bead plaster to stress relieve the cast part.

 

He then said all that he needed to do with brazing was to reheat and let slowly cool.

Not sure your "LP" is referring to? A crack test?

 

Just my past remembrances for what that is worth.

 

DJ

[47 dodge 1.5 ton]

All cracks should be ground approx 45 degrees “V” for a “full penetration weld”, problem is having enough access to grind the internal areas. Brazing is fine and has been done for years with acceptable results. An “LP test is using Liquid penetrant dye to check for surface defects (google this to get a full understanding, very important for good results). I could go in detail but may take a page or so. I stuck mine in the oven for stress relieving and air cooled. I have the temp and hold time written down at the shop but can get that to you. In my experience, bead blasting really is used for wearing surfaces and parts that stretch to smooth sharp corners for reducing “stress points” not so much for this application other than cosmetics(can’t hurt though).

[DJ194950]

45 minutes ago, 47 dodge 1.5 ton said:

All cracks should be ground approx 45 degrees “V” for a “full penetration weld”, problem is having enough access to grind the internal areas. Brazing is fine and has been done for years with acceptable results. An “LP test is using Liquid penetrant dye to check for surface defects (google this to get a full understanding, very important for good results). I could go in detail but may take a page or so. I stuck mine in the oven for stress relieving and air cooled. I have the temp and hold time written down at the shop but can get that to you. In my experience, bead blasting really is used for wearing surfaces and parts that stretch to smooth sharp corners for reducing “stress points” not so much for this application other than cosmetics(can’t hurt though).

Thanks for the info.

 

DJ

[47 dodge 1.5 ton]

Noticed that I didn’t answer your weld question fully, I had mine Tig welded using phosphorus bronze rod, peening only with weld hammer. Then stress relieving in oven at two intervals 1st 1000 degrees held at 30 min and 2nd was 850 degrees held at 1 hour hold time. Slow air cooled with ceramic heat blanket. Also took a picture of the LP kit that I recommend for small shops(there are other options).

Edited November 11, 2020 by 47 dodge 1.5 ton

[Dodgeb4ya]

These 265 truck twin carb/exhaust engines first came out in the 1953 B4K series trucks....running 1953 thru 1957 and possibly 1958.

They used severe duty internals...

Tri-plated bearings,sodium valves, etc.

Too bad today's rebuild parts are not near the quality of factory parts.

[timkingsbury]

Hi Folks -

 

After several emails i best weigh in. The factory dual carb , dual exhaust setup for the 25 1/2" motor was unveiled at the 1951  municipal show and was introduced 1st in the 1952 model year with the 1st delivery to Wellington County in Ontario Canada.  Attached was the dealer poster that was sent to them in late November 1951, showing the introduction of both the hemi and the factory dual carb/ dual exhaust setup.  At that time Chrysler Detroit marketing wanted the HP rating of the 265 engine scaled back as the plan was to push the hemi v9 which actually cost less 

to produce.  The 1st ones were what in Canada we call 4 ton trucks because that is the weight haulage.   By April 1952 they were coming out in 2 1/2 ton and heavier trucks.    It was also the 1st introduction of the 5 speed and 5 speed with overdrive in the bigger trucks.

 

In 1954 the dual carb setup was optional on the 250 ci motor and in 1956 it was optional on any model truck.  My Grandfather bought a 1956 Fargo pickup with a 265 and factory dual carbs and exhaust and  gave it to my Mother for her 18th birthday   Yes i have the line ticket, internal bill of sale and the truck is still in the family.  It was long ago posted on p15d24.  It was a Chrysler internal bill of sale because he worked as the GM of the Windsor Engine Plant.   The dual carb dual exhaust setup was technically available as a factory option up until 1959 whoever

it was more often a dealer add on and you could buy the setup from any dealer who sold Dodge or Fargo trucks.

 

I have the engineering, and shop manuals from 1936 to 1971 and you can clearly see the setup appearing in the 1952 documentation.

I will attach a marketing poster picture and the Chrysler documentation.

 

In terms of welding,  between my Dad,  our buddy George Asche (the other part of AoK Racing) and I we have restored more than 50 of the setups including welding up some exhausts or intakes that people would have said that we restorable.   Some of those now have more than 100,000 miles on them and are over 50 years old and never needed another restoration/

 

Tim

Tim Kingsbury