need for speed in an antique car or truck

[desoto1939]

I am looking for some answers to a question that I am trying to figure out.

 

There was a posting on a facebook page regarding a person looking at a 1937 Desoto coupe that has overdrive. The person was asking if any of the speed equipment from a dodge would fit on his engine. I informed hi that the Desoto has a 25 inch block versus the 23 inch block.

 

The person wants to go over 65 mph in a car that still has the old drum brakes and suspension and single brake line from the master cylinder.

 

My question is why do some guys want to take a vintage car like this 37 Desoto coupe and want to go 60-70 mph in a car that is 83 Years old and has 83 year old technology and risk their lives and their passenger lives with this type of speed?

 

I sent a reply back and knowing the old Desoto line since I have a 39 Desoto I told him then why not get a car from the 60's -70's that can handle these speeds and has radial tires and AC and all of the more modern items.

 

I know everyone has their own thing about old cars but why the need for speed and putting on all of the speed equipment for a car that should only go around 50-60 and also just enjoy the car and the beauty of the car and take sometime to move at a slower pace in life.  You can still travel with the car but take a slower route and enjoy life it is to short.

 

This is just my 25 cents on the soapbox. So looking for some comments from the members.  I will not counter your point of view just want some input to see where everyone is thinking there is no right or wrong answers.

 

Rich Hartung 

[Plymouthy Adams]

first and foremost is the fact that the 1960-70 model cars do not have the curves and style of the 30's...from that aspect owners are going to do what they want regardless and WILL spend the extra dollars for the safety upgrades also.    You also got to realize that any forum are going to be a great number of talkers and precious few doer's....the fact that he is asking this and that question tells me he is inexperienced and probably his first older car and had visions of sugarplums dancing in his head and when he begins to spend x dollars there will be visions of the wife dancing on his head......soap box is free and open to the next poster....

[desoto1939]

Plymouthy: I saw pictures of the 37 Desoto and it was already restored and it was ready to go down the road. I see you point and yeas when he goes to buy the speed parts then he will see the cost involved and then changes that will have to be made.  So why not just get an already retro hotrod completely ready to go off the shelf.

 

Rich

[Plymouthy Adams]

the why this and not another.....he may have inherited this....again...like the style hate the limitation....why I buy old cars with the drivetrains already toast or removed and thus I have no feelings pulling me to stock....I have a stocker....I have a couple more that will return stock....the rest....install the bent engines and full speed ahead...I can easily do both....but I prefer the build over the rebuild.  

[Sniper]

I have a 65 Cuda sharing space with my Cambridge.  If you think the technology on that 65 Cuda makes it safer at 65-70 than the stuff in our rides, you'd be mostly mistaken.  You can put radial tires on our stuff, mine is running them and AC really had nothing to do with safety.  My Cuda does have AC, which was kind of rare back then, but with that big greenhouse of a rear window and the black vinyl interior it doesn't help.   My Cuda had 9" drum brakes, wee.  No sway bars, nothing special.  Both pretty much need the same upgrades to make them better at speed, discs, sway bars, good shocks.  Just remember that the a body Mopar, which the Cuda is, pretty much had the same setup till 73 when discs became standard on the v8 models, but even till the end in 76 they had basically the same suspension, virtually all of it will interchange. 

 

Now is there room for improvement on our older suspension?  yes, but not anything inherently bad, just suspension design has progressed and gotten better, mist of which you wont really see unless you are driving like a mad man on the streets.  The steering linkage being the primary issue.

 

 

 

 

[keithb7]

From my perspective, the great feeling of cruising at 25 MPH in a pre-war car is lost on far too many people. Slowing down, taking in the world around us, is fantastic therapy. The stress of my M-F job, family  and financial obligations melt away. I don't get it, speed in an old car. Nobody was going that fast back in the day. Just like I struggle with white walls on a working man's car, priced for the low end. Whatever...

 

To each their own. I'll do my thing. Feel that that too can do as you please.

[plymouthcranbrook]

I guess I have gone through the change of life as I used to be an incurable Hot rodder until  I hit my mid thirties then the great slowdown began. Now I am the old goat everyone today wants to pass. But being able to enjoy the ride old car or new is just so much more satisfying. Just don't seem to have the inner urge to beat everyone to everywhere.

[Plymouthy Adams]

if you upgrade just to beat everyone...you just lost completely.....

[maok]

I get excited when I get all the way to 30mph in my '28  and 40mph in my '37 down hill. I don't mind taking longer to get to where I want, it means I am driving and enjoying the cars longer....?

[JOhan_Sweden]

Is the goal to run fast or smooth?
Personally, I’ll like to get the rpm down so when I cruise on the highway, the rpm, noise and vibrations will drop. Now I run 50mph but not for long due to the inconvenience.

If I do this with over drive or change of rear axle? Still planning…

 

[Doug&Deb]

Some like the looks of old cars but want the modern conveniences. That’s the appeal of restomods. Myself I want to experience the feel of what it was like to drive the car back in the day. To each his own. There is room for everyone in the hobby.

[Pete]

When I was first learning to drive my father was into sports cars and the occasional muscle car. I really enjoyed driving those cars and still appreciate them, but I guess I got that out of my system early. I remember having a discussion with some coworkers years ago talking about what cars they would like to have and why. Most were muscle cars. I pointed out the bouncing down the back roads in a pre-war car can be just as fun as zooming around. Amazingly, they seemed to get it.

 

Pete

 

[Dan Hiebert]

I think piecemealing an old car to make it run down the road, or get off the line, to modern car expectations is not the way to go.  If you want '30s styling and modern performance, you should "restomod" the car and be safe.  If you just want it to run a bit safer, smoother, and better, to me that is a different thing, as is period speed equipment.  I like the majestic pace of older cars, but I don't mind making it handle or ride a bit better at the same time.  Over the years, I've looked at buying several '30s cars, and the seller always told me the car could do 60 or 70 down the highway as a selling point.  To me, that meant the car was driven past its capabilities (excessive wear on almost every component - on top of its age), the owner didn't fully appreciate it, and that would send me down the "don't buy it" path.   

[Plymouthy Adams]

lots of people misuse a car regardless of its make, model or intended use by design....I would venture to say that the largest number of owners own the car they do because its outward appearance appealed to them.   In many cases, this is where loyalty ceases and upgrades begin.  But as with many folks there is a limit to what is needed for the street.  The b-body Mopar folks is such a crowd that even if the car was factory a moderate V8, even a factory performance engine, nothing but a full blown 440 0r 426 is going to make them happy and that is something I cannot identify with nor see the need but YET I love these body styles also and a few of them.  Sometimes it has nothing to do with sensibility.  I have not been guilty of pumping up an engine much over stock except with the one Sunbeam Tiger, nothing wrong here with a 100 extra ponies.

[MackTheFinger]

Excuse me while I digress. I just spoke for a '48 D24 that doesn't have an engine and transmission. I have a good stock engine and transmission I can bolt straight in and be driving in a weekend or two or three. Part of me wants to drop in a later model V-8 drivetrain, power steering, disc brakes, all that stuff, and most likely never getting the car on the road. I won't drive the D24 enough to matter and if I go on a long trip I probably wouldn't take it anyway so stock is good enough. The only change I'm considering is rear gearing since I have a Dakota rear and an 8.8 Explorer rear. If the motor or transmission goes "BANG" I might consider changing at that point. I don't even need another car.. It's a sickness, I tell ya!!

[Sam Buchanan]

 

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Edited June 10, 2020 by Sam Buchanan

[Sam Buchanan]

1 hour ago, Dan Hiebert said:

.......the majestic pace of older cars......

 

And that is the best description of why we drive these old cars that I've seen........

[Plymouthy Adams]

2 hours ago, Sam Buchanan said:

 

And that is the best description of why we drive these old cars that I've seen........

ranks right up there with tired butt old retired codgers in their motor homes in the far left lane 10 or greater below the speed limit....place for everything....if you realized you capacity and stick within that envelope fine, people can account for your speed if you are in the correct lane...else just curl up and die and get it over with...just do it in the far right lane is all....

[Ulu]

While I don't think I need over 100 HP in a grocery getter, I typically own 200 HP cars.

 

BUT, Since I sold my Cadillac, my inclination has been to eschew large engines and just shave weight.

I've owned light sporty cars and big porky ones. The P15 was right in the middle, but after I bought it I started adding weight.

Eventually I reversed course. I hope to remove a lot of weight in the future.

I've owned several rolling divans from the big 3, and I got over the want of that sort of luxury.

 

I own a sports truck and a sports sedan. I fully intend to sporterize the P15.

It's a different sort of luxury, not having to haul what you don't need. 

 

[Veemoney]

After driving any vehicle on the highway at 70+ around here when I get onto the off ramp I have to remind myself to slow it down going forward.

 

When I started driving the older cars and trucks it also took some adjustment for me to fully enjoy going slow. For my 47 WC I purchased a 2-carb intake set-up and a T5 trans, next I found a 48 rear end complete with a highway gear. As I was getting all the parts and driving the truck I started appreciating the old battle wagon and still drive it essentially as delivered from the factory. I do still tend to come off the line fast if I'm first at the light and I learned taking off in 3rd and then shifting to 4th makes for a more enjoyable ride.

 

14 hours ago, Sniper said:

I have a 65 Cuda sharing space with my Cambridge.

I always enjoy seeing an old fish picture of a Cuda or Marlin of that era.

[Ulu]

15 hours ago, desoto1939 said:

. . . why do some guys want to take a vintage car like this 37 Desoto coupe and want to go 60-70 mph in a car that is 83 Years old and has 83 year old technology and risk their lives and their passenger lives with this type of speed?

 

I ride a motorcycle. I've had 7 now, since 1968.

 

The most rattletrap hotrod car is normally still safer than motorcycling.

(Though it all depends on the nut holding the wheel . . . grips, whatever.)

 

I say this having crashed a bike many times, in many ways, been hit by cars, nearly hit, and knowing how easily it could kill you.

Myself, I've never suffered more than minor scrapes and bruises . . . one serious bruise . . . never needed medical attention, and I basically rode home every time with a bent fender or a broken light, but I have a few  little scars.

 

I am also lucky as hell to be here, and clearly living on borrowed time.

I will someday document all my mishaps in one spot, if I continue to survive.

 

Anyhow, folks, it's all relative. That guy in a Desoto might be much better off than the guy he hits.

[RobertKB]

I personally like all my old cars stock. I have two good originals and two restored cars. I like the old powertrains but if restoring will use different materials in the interior. I drive the cars lots and know the slower roads to travel once out of town. I just like the sense of history you get driving down the road in a car built decades ago.

 

Although I am not a fan of hotrods, I can appreciate the work that goes into them. What I really don't like is when a hotrodder takes a good original or restored vehicle and cuts it up. I have no problem with a car that is a basket case or minus most of its powertrain being hotrodded. 

[plymouthcranbrook]

As I read several years ago and I quote” Many people think that they want an old car but what they really want is a 2014 Toyota that looks like an old car”

[Sniper]

2 hours ago, plymouthcranbrook said:

As I read several years ago and I quote” Many people think that they want an old car but what they really want is a 2014 Toyota that looks like an old car”

 

 

I am definitely not one of those, lol.  I can appreciate a stock type ride but for me I like things hot rodded.  Nothing so permanent it couldn't be undone, but I don't have a problem upgrading things either.  I am on the cusp of getting an adapter to put one of my spare A833OD's behind the flathead, I'll keep the original trans, driveshaft and what ever else I remove putting this in, but it'll not be stock.  Same with my engine upgrades, I will still have the stock parts I removed, but it'll be updated with better stuff.  No plans to put in a different engine, just update the one I have.  Brakes too.  So much stuff, so little time.

[Los_Control]

imho, I think speed is something that will get your adrenaline flowing, A little bit of butt pucker and eyes wide open and a smile on your face ....

 

I can get all of those driving a stock antique car by over driving the stock steering, suspension, brakes .... no need for me to go fast