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Cylinder Sucker Tool


Bingster

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I had been pouring motor oil and Marvel oil down the cylinders of my flat head over time to prevent them from seizing,  thinking that the oils would seep down around the pistons. On the first cranking with no plugs yesterday, cylinders five and six threw up oil like a fireworks show. The others were stuck. So much for that approach.

 

I'm thinking the thinner viscosity 50/50 acetone and tranny fluid would have worked better over time.  I was told that there is/was a vacuum kind of tool that fitted down into the cylinder and sucked out the excess oil before start-up.  It makes sense to me. Would save a lot of engine compartment cleaning. Any ideas on this? Maybe I should re-phrase that. Anyone ever hear of this?

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Cylinders 5 and six threw oil 6 feet other cylinders are still stuck? How does that work?

 

In regards to sucking oil back out, the spark plug holes are not directly above the cylinders.  The holes are over the intake valves. Some type of flexible line will be needed to bend it down the hole,  then 90 degrees over to the cylinder chamber. Turkey baster will likely not do it. 

 

Seek out Mityvac tools. Not just for this one job. They work very well and are great for other vehicle maintenance. Brake bleeding. Diff oil. Tranny oil. Engine oil. Master cylinder fluid. Any fluid changes. I use mine a lot. Easy.  No mess. 

 

Might be best to pull the head to evacuate the fluids you have poured into your cylinders. 

Edited by keithb7
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Hey Bingster,

Been thinking on this for a few days. Pistons 5 and 6 threw out oil. Good. You engine isn't seized. The other pistons, either the valves were open and the oil drained past that way or the piston rings were compressed and the oil drained past them. Either way sounds like the engine is in decent shape and just needs a compression check to tell for sure. If there is low or no compression then the piston rings or the valves are stuck. If the rings are stuck, some ATF will likely loosen them, same with the valves because they are probably stuck open and the ATF fluid will drain down into the guides. If you put some compressed air to the plug holes (about 20 psi with the piston at TDC) and listen for air at the carb, exhaust and the oil fill tube, that will tell either intake valve or exhaust valve or piston rings are stuck in that order. Since the spark plug hole is over the valves and not the piston, you will have to rotate the crank to get each affected piston to TDC which will close the valves and allow oil or ATF to cover the piston and soak the rings. Not hard or complicated just a little time consuming. Also remember to follow the firing order 153624.

 

Joe Lee

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On 10/20/2019 at 12:52 PM, keithb7 said:

Cylinders 5 and six threw oil 6 feet other cylinders are still stuck? How does that work?

 

In regards to sucking oil back out, the spark plug holes are not directly above the cylinders.  The holes are over the intake valves. Some type of flexible line will be needed to bend it down the hole,  then 90 degrees over to the cylinder chamber. Turkey baster will likely not do it. 

 

Seek out Mityvac tools. Not just for this one job. They work very well and are great for other vehicle maintenance. Brake bleeding. Diff oil. Tranny oil. Engine oil. Master cylinder fluid. Any fluid changes. I use mine a lot. Easy.  No mess. 

 

Might be best to pull the head to evacuate the fluids you have poured into your cylinders. 

When the piston is at TDC, it is within a few thousandths of the same height as the valves.  So makes little difference where your sucking from.  Pull out all you can that way and crank it over with a rag over the open spark plugs holes.  Done.

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2 hours ago, kencombs said:

When the piston is at TDC, it is within a few thousandths of the same height as the valves.  So makes little difference where your sucking from.  Pull out all you can that way and crank it over with a rag over the open spark plugs holes.  Done.

 

That works if the crank will actually turn over. If you have poured oil down the cylinders of a seized engine, waited some time and it still won’t turn over, you’ll have oil in cylinders with pistons not at TDC. Then getting that oil out becomes problematic as I described. 

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  • 3 months later...

Thanks so much for the info. This is my first foray into the actual mechanics of the engine. All of the add-ons are completed: new coil, plugs, wires, starter rebuilt, etc.  I had the piston/valve set-up differently in my head. I can now see how if two cylinders were working the others had to be, i.e., not frozen.

This is going to be a learning curve for sure. I have to get a compression testor now.

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Suction gun. Less than 10 dollars. 
you are going to have to pull the head. Easy on these flatheads. 
my 218 was stuck solid. Pulled head,poured the magic juice on all the pistons. Three leaked past the rings-so not seized.most of the valves were stuck. So, whacked with a hammer and kept rolling it over. As you can see it was prettty ugly. got it to run, now I run it every weekend to get it into shop, -26 celcius was the coldest temp i started it. 
I reused the copper head gasket, didnt want to spend a bunch of money if it was a boat anchor. 
40 psi oil  pressure to boot. 

FEA858E8-0A8C-41D6-AB68-5FFA7C068FEC.jpeg

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Is this a non fluid drive car?  If so, put it in third gear get some helpers and rock it back and forth. That will either free the stuck cylinders verify that something is still stuck.  Unless you have a broken crank shaft if 5 & 6 and six are moving the others should be too.  If the car will roll, you can also try towing it slowly in third with the clutch in then release the clutch so the wheels will turn the engine over.  Good idea to have brakes if you try this.  If your road is level parking brake should suffice.  Long chain or tow strap recommended. Doo this with spark plugs out.

Edited by greg g
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On the end of the head towards the firewall there is a pipe plug, that is used to check TDC.  I just drop a skinny screwdriver in there after that pipe pluf plug is removed and roll the engine over by hand till it tops out, I note where the crank is then keep rolling it till it starts to drop and not the position of the crank, the middle of those two points movement is TDC.

 

The service manual shows the details 

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To answer the original question, there are suction devices but it isn’t going to do as good as you want it to. First off not all the cylinders will be holding the magic oil as there will be leakage past rings and or open valves. I recommend cranking it over with absorbent  rags over the plug holes. Secondly you got no oil out those 2 cylinders because the oil leaked past the rings or valves.

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11 hours ago, Bingster said:

Will the Harbor Freight compresion tester be any good?

I've had mine for over 10 years. 4 of those years the tool was used when I work for a Motorcycle and atv shop. Never had a problem with the Harbor Freight tools.

 

Joe Lee

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So if the valves are stuck open and fluid finds its way into the intake exhaust, then what happens as the engine is turned with no plugs, or even with plugs? Am I in danger of hydro locking?

If any fluid gets down past the valves in general, will it dissipate with the heat from the engine?  I don't know the mechanics of the machinery down there to get a picture in my mind of the situation.

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If it gets past the valves, it will be in either the intake or exhaust manifold.  If exhaust, it will just make it's way out of the muffler and tailpipe.  At worst, lots of smoke.   If intake, also lots of smoke as all of it will be burned if/when the engine starts. With no plugs, nothing will happen, except for making a mess.  With plugs, no mess, also no danger of hydro lock IF the fluid isn't in any cylinder.

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58 minutes ago, Bingster said:

I don't know the mechanics of the machinery down there to get a picture in my mind of the situation.

 

Ok...time to go to school, there is no point in being uninformed about what is inside your engine. 

 

Here is a video from one of our own forum members as he takes a look inside the flathead engine:

 

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RQNszFmHJHQ

 

Edited by Sam Buchanan
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