Jump to content

Grinding Gears or Clashing


Guest

Recommended Posts

With the 49 Chrysler Windsor Idling and I am sitting behind the wheel , I push the clutch to the floor and pull the shifter to me and down I get one heck of a clash and after reading the repair manual I cannot find any where as to how to adjust the shifting mechanism 

Link to comment
Share on other sites

First gear is not synchronized. You could try holding the clutch down a few seconds to allow the gears to stop, then try to put it into first. If this does not work then I suggest that you check the free play on the clutch pedal.  The clutch may not be disengaging fully.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Probably not a shift linkage issue.  Rather, the clutch is not releasing fully, engine idling to high, you're not waiting long enough to let the gears stop turning or a host of other things.  a little more info would help. 

 

If the car has been sitting/not run for a while that can cause a stuck clutch.

 

Lack of adequate free play can cause the clutch not to release fully.

 

A high idle will spin the gears faster and you would need to wait a few seconds after pushing the clutch in for them to stop..

 

I've seen transmissions filled with chassis grease to stop leaks.  also spins the gears when it shouldn't.

 

Is this when shifting into low or reverse only, or all gears.

 

I'd check the pedal free play first.  Also, try putting it in high before trying low or reverse.

 

 

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Please check the free play and report back.  

 

If I understand your post correctly, what you turned when installing the trans, was actually the flywheel.  So the clutch was not moving independent of the engine. 

 

With this new background info, there is another suspect.  If the PO had the clutch out, it may be installed backwards and the hub springs hitting the flywheel bolts.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Try this. Instead of shifting into first gear shift into second gear first then shift into first gear. Second gear is synchronized and will stop the main shaft inside the transmission from rotating and allow you to shift into first gear with no grinding. 

  • Like 4
Link to comment
Share on other sites

3 minutes ago, Don Coatney said:

Try this. Instead of shifting into first gear shift into second gear first then shift into first gear. Second gear is synchronized and will stop the main shaft inside the transmission from rotating and allow you to shift into first gear with no grinding. 

 

When did having synchronizers on first gear become standard? Certainly some time after the '63 Plymouth I learned to drive on was built. . .

 

In any case, it was pretty common to either wait a while between when you stepped on the clutch to try to engage 1st. Or so as Don suggests, move the gear lever to one of the synchronized speeds (2nd or high) to stop things spinning in the transmission then move the lever to first. So second nature to me that I forget that people born/raised/learned to drive in a more recent era wouldn't know to do that.

  • Like 1
Link to comment
Share on other sites

4 hours ago, Don Coatney said:

Try this. Instead of shifting into first gear shift into second gear first then shift into first gear. Second gear is synchronized and will stop the main shaft inside the transmission from rotating and allow you to shift into first gear with no grinding. 

BINGO! I can't remember a car I owned or drove as a kid that I didn't have to do this.

  • Like 1
Link to comment
Share on other sites

9 hours ago, Don Coatney said:

Try this. Instead of shifting into first gear shift into second gear first then shift into first gear. Second gear is synchronized and will stop the main shaft inside the transmission from rotating and allow you to shift into first gear with no grinding. 

This is exactly what I do with my car as well.  :)

Link to comment
Share on other sites

My 47 DeSoto (Tiptoe Shift semi-automatic) has a tag on the transmission that says to fill with 10 wt oil.  The usual transmission oil would be too thick for the upshift plumbing.  (And the fluid coupling gets the AW32.) 

  • Like 1
Link to comment
Share on other sites

36 minutes ago, wisconsinjimmy said:

This is hard to understand, the book calls for 10W oil and what I drained out of the tranny was some kind of oil now the hydraulic oil I put in is classified as 10W. What I do not understand is how the tranny shifts Is there a pump in the transmission ?  Also the torque converter or fluid coupling how does that work as I saw no fluid leakage when I took the tranny out, Does the converter expand so it engages the clutch?

   

Here is the most concise explanation I've found, copied from Wiki:

Operation

Attached to the transmission was an “underdrive” with a reduction gear of 1.75/1. The shift lever was column-mounted and had three positions: Low (in the “2nd” position of a conventional 3-speed manual unit), High (in the “3rd” position), and Reverse (same as the 3-speed). The clutch had to be depressed every time the gear shift lever was moved. When the lever was put in Low, the car started in “underdrive” low; when the vehicle reached a minimum speed of 6 mph (9.7 km/h), the driver lifted his foot off the accelerator, the underdrive unit would kick out and the car would be in Low. Similarly, with the lever in High position, the car would start in underdrive high, and at any speed above 13 mph (21 km/h), the driver would lift his foot and the car would “shift” into direct drive.

This configuration had the effect of providing 4 gear ratios:

  • Underdrive Low, 3.57/1,
  • Low 2.04/1,
  • Underdrive High, 1.75/1,
  • High, 1/1.

In order for the unit to work without gear clashing, it contained a freewheeling device (in Underdrive, Low and High), and the Owner’s manual cautioned drivers not to use “1st or 3rd” gear when descending hills, because there was no engine compression braking in those free-wheeling ranges. Generally, most drivers started an M6 car in High and accomplished the shift to direct drive somewhere between 13 and 25 MPH by releasing the accelerator pedal and waiting for the “clunk” that signaled the disengagement of the underdrive. An M6 car would automatically shift from High down to underdrive high when car speed dropped below approximately 11 MPH.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

54 minutes ago, kencombs said:

Here is the most concise explanation I've found, copied from Wiki:

Operation

Attached to the transmission was an “underdrive” with a reduction gear of 1.75/1. The shift lever was column-mounted and had three positions: Low (in the “2nd” position of a conventional 3-speed manual unit), High (in the “3rd” position), and Reverse (same as the 3-speed). The clutch had to be depressed every time the gear shift lever was moved. When the lever was put in Low, the car started in “underdrive” low; when the vehicle reached a minimum speed of 6 mph (9.7 km/h), the driver lifted his foot off the accelerator, the underdrive unit would kick out and the car would be in Low. Similarly, with the lever in High position, the car would start in underdrive high, and at any speed above 13 mph (21 km/h), the driver would lift his foot and the car would “shift” into direct drive.

This configuration had the effect of providing 4 gear ratios:

  • Underdrive Low, 3.57/1,
  • Low 2.04/1,
  • Underdrive High, 1.75/1,
  • High, 1/1.

In order for the unit to work without gear clashing, it contained a freewheeling device (in Underdrive, Low and High), and the Owner’s manual cautioned drivers not to use “1st or 3rd” gear when descending hills, because there was no engine compression braking in those free-wheeling ranges. Generally, most drivers started an M6 car in High and accomplished the shift to direct drive somewhere between 13 and 25 MPH by releasing the accelerator pedal and waiting for the “clunk” that signaled the disengagement of the underdrive. An M6 car would automatically shift from High down to underdrive high when car speed dropped below approximately 11 MPH.

Damn shame Mother Mopar didn't try to make their transmissions and transmission servicing confusing,ain't it?

Link to comment
Share on other sites

6 minutes ago, wisconsinjimmy said:

will the plate on the fire wall tell me what trans I have?

I have the Presto-Matic transmission

 

This is what you posted and all my answers/suggestions have been predicated on that.  I hope you really have that one

Edited by kencombs
Link to comment
Share on other sites

3 hours ago, Plymouthy Adams said:

yes but look at their survivability................................................!

Probably because everybody was afraid to fool with them.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

do yourself and everyone here a favor and snap a picture of the passenger side of the transmission.....this should help identify what you have but to be honest with  you...the M6 is so distinctly different in looks to the also available base three speed it would be hard not to know the difference as I do not think pictures are in Russian...?

Link to comment
Share on other sites

If you have the semi-automatic transmission, there will be wires running to the carburetor from the transmission.  These wires, on the right side of the transmission, can be seen from beneath the car, but better with the floor pan access cover removed. Remove the access panel, and you can see wires running from the solenoid, governor, and interruptor switch.   

And yes, there is a pump in the transmimssion, to send the 10 wt oil into a piston that performs the semi-automatic shift.  My shop manual shows this extensively and explains the operation.

With either type of transmission, you may have some wires on the left side of the transmission, to control a backup light. 

 

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Join the conversation

You can post now and register later. If you have an account, sign in now to post with your account.

Guest
Reply to this topic...

×   Pasted as rich text.   Paste as plain text instead

  Only 75 emoji are allowed.

×   Your link has been automatically embedded.   Display as a link instead

×   Your previous content has been restored.   Clear editor

×   You cannot paste images directly. Upload or insert images from URL.

×
×
  • Create New...

Important Information

We have placed cookies on your device to help make this website better. You can adjust your cookie settings, otherwise we'll assume you're okay to continue.

Terms of Use