Newby Advice Request - Is this 1950 3/4 a Good Deal

[Big Easy]

This is a 1950 3/4 ton 4 Speed Fluid Drive that runs nicely. New 12 Volt conversion and Gas Tank (see photo).  The seller is my local mechanic.  He and his dad buy old Dodge cars and trucks and fix them up.  He has a new B Series project, so he's selling this one.

 

He is asking $6,800.00

 

Negotiable, but are we in the ball park?  From my research, I've seen rusty trucks with no motor and transmission for $3,000, and I've seen beautifully restored trucks for around this same price (also seen frame-offs up to 35K range).

 

Any advice would be appreciated.

 

Thank you

 

 

 

 

Edited March 21, 2016 by Big Easy

[Jeff Balazs]

Have you driven it? And does it live up to your expectations?

What else has been done to it? Brakes..and did the brake lines get replaced?....wiring.....clutch etc... Engine compression and oil pressure? How is the interior?

Window rubber? All this stuff can really add up. It may be worth that kind of money....but it is very hard to tell from your photos. Kind of depends on what all has been done and how well it was done. The fuel tank may be a clue.

 

Jeff

[Big Easy]

I'm going to talk to the guy today.  I will update with new information about what all has been done to the truck later this evening.  I was going to drive it today, but we got quite a bit of snow here last night. I'll ask about the tank. I don't know if he "liked" it like that, or if it was a short cut or lazy issue.  I kind of like it.

 

Thank you for your answer.  Gives me questions to ask him.

[Jeff Balazs]

You are welcome. The 3/4 ton trucks have some parts on them that are unique to that model. Stuff like a bad brake drum as an example can be very hard to find.

Also the fluid drive trucks have unique parts. Not as hard to find as the brake drums......but not too common either.

 

If it were me after driving it I would ask him to do a compression test. Also if you can get him to put it up on the rack so you can have a good look-see.

Quite a lot of the wear items are fairly easy to find......but don't take anything for granted. I think if it drives nice and seems fairly solid it might be a good buy.

 

Jeff

[NiftyFifty]

Looks like it needs some body work, just a spray over what was there...I'm with Jeff...once you have so more powertrain info then it might be easier to assess value. $6800 US seems high to me, but your market may be smaller for availability of those trucks.

[Ralph Pearce]

I've got a 1948 3/4 ton without fluid drive, and have about 8K into it with most everything gone through. I also agree with Jeff. The truck looks basically healthy, but would like to know about the engine, fuel, brakes, electrical, gauges, frame straight and healthy, any known issues...I agree with fuel/brake line replacement and also wonder what's-up with the gas tank. In terms of parts for 3/4 tons, I think the only real concern would be drums, though I found a shop that can reline them when worn out. You always have the options to replace the entire rear end and/or convert the front to disc.

[NiftyFifty]

Re-line drums? Or the shoes? I didn't know they could safely re-line a drum..but I've never looked for that option either

[Ram Man 02]

I had my truck appraised a couple summers ago and it came back at $5k, this is a stock 1/2, 6volt, drum brakes, 4sp, 5 window cab. The paint job was newer but done my an amateur so it looks good from 10' away but has its flaws. the interior is decent but the headliner in gone. Id say they are on the high side but in the ballpark depending on what has been replaced in the driveline and what condition the interior is in. New door seals, window rubber, and interior panels will add up fast

 

If it needs brakes the rusty hope disc brake conversion might interest you. research it a little bit and see if its the route you want to go with the truck.

[Plymouthy Adams]

4mula-dlx, on 22 Mar 2016 - 11:28 PM, said:

Re-line drums? Or the shoes? I didn't know they could safely re-line a drum..but I've never looked for that option either

I am not sure this is a common practice but a machinist friend of mine has done this procedure for some of his own cars with no adverse effects..

[Don Coatney]

Finding a machinist willing to accept the liability may be an issue. My good friend machinist refused to sleeve a master cylinder for a customer due to liability issues.

[ggdad1951]

I am not sure this is a common practice but a machinist friend of mine has done this procedure for some of his own cars with no adverse effects..

 

considering this has been tried multiple times by companies with way more recources that a guy in his shop and have not been succesful, I'd not ride with your friend nor drive in front of him.  From an engineering/metalurgy aspect, it's dangerous at a minimum.

[Plymouthy Adams]

I assure you with this type service the term "pay to play" will be key

 

http://www.jgrelining.com/

[Plymouthy Adams]

ggdad1951, on 23 Mar 2016 - 08:31 AM, said:

considering this has been tried multiple times by companies with way more recources that a guy in his shop and have not been succesful, I'd not ride with your friend nor drive in front of him.  From an engineering/metalurgy aspect, it's dangerous at a minimum.

perhaps one should do some more research..

[wayfarer]

For a trailer queen a repaired drum should be just fine....for something that might actually save your life then I'd be switching to disc...

[ggdad1951]

perhaps one should do some more research..

perhaps one did when he was working on his truck and was told by everyone he talked to it's a bad ide to try and reline drums.  And perhaps my drums aren't aluminum?

 

Comes down to that old drums that are cast iron/steel and you can't simply weld in new material w/o warping the whole thing and having issues w/ porosity or potential delamination of the added material from the parent casting.  I'll take the knowledge of companies that have been doing brakes for 50+ years and everyone else over your one website that only talks aluminim.

[Plymouthy Adams]

I am afraid that you did not read far enough into the website...each person can do as they wish with their cars...the services are available and at a cost..just because the local boys are unaware does not make it undoable, just undoable to them or out of their wheelhouse of current experience...these Mopar cars and trucks are still falling out of the trees and are not anywhere into the rare or uncommon area of the car hobby when it come to parts excepting maybe for the Airflow so yeah..these services are basically unheard of in the common everyday run of the mill mass production cars that litter the American highways..

[ggdad1951]

I am afraid that you did not read far enough into the website...each person can do as they wish with their cars...the services are available and at a cost..just because the local boys are unaware does not make it undoable, just undoable to them or out of their wheelhouse of current experience...these Mopar cars and trucks are still falling out of the trees and are not anywhere into the rare or uncommon area of the car hobby when it come to parts excepting maybe for the Airflow so yeah..these services are basically unheard of in the common everyday run of the mill mass production cars that litter the American highways..

actually I read the WHOLE website....and there is lots of talk about ALUMINUM drums with a cast liner inserted.  Point me to where it talks about iron drums being relined.  

 

I posed the question here years ago and was scoffed at for the concept.

 

Hate to tell you my "local boys" I talked to actually were all over the country and the local company I did contact covers a 8 state area....so not so "local".  Understanding a bit of engineering, metalurgy and basic physics as I do....just not a good idea period.  If it was such a good idea, I'd find more than the one website out there advertising having "300" drums out in service...

 

it's really basic thermodynamics, heat transfer and physics....eventually this will fail, and fail badly when the brake is needed the most (or randomly as you are driving down the road locking up a wheel).

 

just own up to the fact PA this isn't a good idea.

[Plymouthy Adams]

ggdad1951, on 23 Mar 2016 - 3:18 PM, said:

actually I read the WHOLE website....and there is lots of talk about ALUMINUM drums with a cast liner inserted.  Point me to where it talks about iron drums being relined.  

 

I posed the question here years ago and was scoffed at for the concept.

 

Hate to tell you my "local boys" I talked to actually were all over the country and the local company I did contact covers a 8 state area....so not so "local".  Understanding a bit of engineering, metalurgy and basic physics as I do....just not a good idea period.  If it was such a good idea, I'd find more than the one website out there advertising having "300" drums out in service...

 

it's really basic thermodynamics, heat transfer and physics....eventually this will fail, and fail badly when the brake is needed the most (or randomly as you are driving down the road locking up a wheel).

 

just own up to the fact PA this isn't a good idea.

ok look at the very company description....

 

 

J&G BRAKE DRUM RELINING & REFURBISHING​

Aluminum & Cast Brake Drums​

(815) 276-2578

 

That says it all..and if I were to be concerned of any relining issues, I assure I would take a cast iron reline over that of the aluminum anyday...if you read a bit more into the who what where and why you will see that the challenge thrown to him in the beginning was that of the aluminum as their existence in replacement was notta....therefore his specialty, but not his sole line of work...again, these are for cars of a certain rare vintage and not as I said for the everyday mass production cars that are still as the leaves falling from the trees yet today...but they can be done...but it is not what I would call cost advantageous, read my pay to play statement, given the many of these old everyday cars and trucks being modified and brake parts just lying around cluttering back shops not to mention the many flathead engines being used as door stops or boat anchors..in time and down the ages if we are blessed with long life and ability to hand down to the next generation, this service could well be "cat's meow"

[Ralph Pearce]

actually I read the WHOLE website....and there is lots of talk about ALUMINUM drums with a cast liner inserted.  Point me to where it talks about iron drums being relined.  

 

I posed the question here years ago and was scoffed at for the concept.

 

Hate to tell you my "local boys" I talked to actually were all over the country and the local company I did contact covers a 8 state area....so not so "local".  Understanding a bit of engineering, metalurgy and basic physics as I do....just not a good idea period.  If it was such a good idea, I'd find more than the one website out there advertising having "300" drums out in service...

 

it's really basic thermodynamics, heat transfer and physics....eventually this will fail, and fail badly when the brake is needed the most (or randomly as you are driving down the road locking up a wheel).

 

just own up to the fact PA this isn't a good idea.

 

 

     Yes, this is the outfit that I contacted (J & G), and yes they reline cast iron drums.  Last year a fellow named Don gave me an estimate of $320 plus shipping per drum.  I decided to just go with cleaning up my current drums for now (not bad, but not turnable), and they stop me just fine. Before deciding on relining the drums, I would look further into the techniques employed, then check with my local expert Tom Holthaus at Quality Machine Shop in Santa Clara.  Before doing that though, I think I'd probably switch to discs in the front and mount a pair of turnable rear drums I just picked up.  Should last me for as long as I need, and I also hear that some brake lining is more "drum friendly" so as to extend the life of the drum.  Lots of options. 

Edited March 23, 2016 by Ralph Pearce

[Jeff Balazs]

Hopefully the original poster isn't put off by this little tangent. I mentioned the brake drums only because they are unique to the 3/4 ton model trucks. There are a few other items like the wheels 5x5 x15" and the 9/16" diameter lugs that can become part of a protracted hunt as well if missing or damaged. These are things that need to be understood when looking hard at this model.

I think they are worth the extra effort though as they have a very fine ride just as they are.

 

Jeff

[pflaming]

I am no expert on pricing but have spent a few hours in and under a Pilot-house. My response is this: I would put Rusty Hopes disc brakes on the front, change the rear axle to a modern jerokee 3:54 with disc brakes, new brake lines unless he has done so, and check the compression and oil pressure.

 

Add that in at an estimate of $1,000 you do the work, and then to me it all depends on your pocket book.  Oh, and I would take a couple of leaves out of the rear springs and level the stance. That would then be a real looker. JMHO.

 

Showed my fire enhanced exterior today and the looker said, "do not paint that truck!"  So again, beauty is in the eye of the beholder.

[Jeff Balazs]

I am no expert on pricing but have spent a few hours in and under a Pilot-house. My response is this: I would put Rusty Hopes disc brakes on the front, change the rear axle to a modern jerokee 3:54 with disc brakes, new brake lines unless he has done so, and check the compression and oil pressure.

 

Add that in at an estimate of $1,000 you do the work, and then to me it all depends on your pocket book.  Oh, and I would take a couple of leaves out of the rear springs and level the stance. That would then be a real looker. JMHO.

 

Showed my fire enhanced exterior today and the looker said, "do not paint that truck!"  So again, beauty is in the eye of the beholder.

The OP is I believe trying to determine if this truck he is looking at is priced fairly for the condition it is currently in. It may or may not be? One of the things he should really look closely at is if it has body cancer. In his part of the country this is a very real possibility. No one has brought this up but I think it could have a very big effect on the over all value of this truck. I would be much more concerned about this than any future upgrades to the brakes etc.

Depending on how and where he is planning to use the truck major upgrades may not be needed. Rotting sheet metal and leaks into the cab are another thing altogether.

 

Jeff

[pflaming]

Jeff, 10-4, then after those determinations are made, then if POSITIVE, I would want the upgrades I mentioned. After driving my truck disc brakes, better rear differential ratio, and etc., make my truck a modern freeway friendly truck and I only have a 3:73 ratio. I would like to have that extra 10 +/- mph and a bit better mpg than what I have. Last trip my truck took, BBQ in 2016 (ops 2014), at semi-truck speeds got 16+ mph which I did not think was too bad. 

Edited March 24, 2016 by pflaming

[Plymouthy Adams]

pflaming, on 24 Mar 2016 - 12:17 PM, said:

Jeff, 10-4, then after those determinations are made, then if POSITIVE, I would want the upgrades I mentioned. After driving my truck disc brakes, better rear differential ratio, and etc., make my truck a modern freeway friendly truck and I only have a 3:73 ratio. I would like to have that extra 10 +/- mph and a bit better mpg than what I have. Last trip my truck took, BBQ in 2016, at semi-truck speeds got 16+ mph which I did not think was too bad. 

last trip BBQ 2016...what you got in that truck...a flux capacitor

[ggdad1951]

ok look at the very company description....

 

 

J&G BRAKE DRUM RELINING & REFURBISHING​

Aluminum & Cast Brake Drums​

(815) 276-2578

 

That says it all..and if I were to be concerned of any relining issues, I assure I would take a cast iron reline over that of the aluminum anyday...if you read a bit more into the who what where and why you will see that the challenge thrown to him in the beginning was that of the aluminum as their existence in replacement was notta....therefore his specialty, but not his sole line of work...again, these are for cars of a certain rare vintage and not as I said for the everyday mass production cars that are still as the leaves falling from the trees yet today...but they can be done...but it is not what I would call cost advantageous, read my pay to play statement, given the many of these old everyday cars and trucks being modified and brake parts just lying around cluttering back shops not to mention the many flathead engines being used as door stops or boat anchors..in time and down the ages if we are blessed with long life and ability to hand down to the next generation, this service could well be "cat's meow"

 

NO WHERE in his website does he talk about relining a cast iron drum, just in his company name.  He could call his comapny "Pink Elephant relining" and it would mean just as much.

 

From everything I know how the world works...not a good idea.  If it was such a good idea, there would be more than one company out there doing it.  Especially at those prices.  

 

I'm done with this, you are being stuborn and oblivious to the reality of the situation.

 

Back to the OP discussion.