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Scarebird Disc Brake Hub Issue


Branded

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Anyone had issues with Scarebird hubs not being deep enough to position the inner seal on the machined seal surface of the spindle. When the seal is installed in the hub it is almost touching the inner bear. I have been e mailing back and for with Scarebird for 2 weeks and all I get is it should fit.

I could return everything I suppose but I have bought rotors, calipers, hoses, dust caps from Rock Auto. Parts have been installed so there's no returning. I'm at the end of my rope.

Dave

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All part where what he said to use. I even installed the NAPA seal he requires for his kit. The problem is the hub doesn't go on far enough or should I say hub is machined to short to allow seal to ride on the sealing area of the spindle . See above picture 3/8 inch of the seal area exposed. Seal just touches the seal area of the spindle. He said it looks like I was putting the hub on backwards, that's impossible the inner and out bearing are different sizes.

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His last response via e mail was (the seal should fit) the seal alway did fit the hub. Hub just doesn't position seal over the machined area the seal needs to cover on the spindle. You can see this in the pictures.

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You'll need to determine if the hub you're using is machined to specs.  Take the bearings out and measure the depth of the bore steps.  Maybe the bearing race isn't fully seated against it's stop.   Your pictures don't show where the steps are on the spindle and because the hub, bearings and seals may be different than the factory brake setup, they may not sit in the same place on the spindle.  While it's off, see if the bearing will slide all the way on to the bearing's stop on the spindle.

Edited by Dave72dt
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You'll need to determine if the hub you're using is machined to specs.  Take the bearings out and measure the depth of the bore steps.  Maybe the bearing race isn't fully seated against it's stop.   Your pictures don't show where the steps are on the spindle and because the hub, bearings and seals may be different than the factory brake setup, they may not sit in the same place on the spindle.  While it's off, see if the bearing will slide all the way on to the bearing's stop on the spindle.

Bearing races and bearings included seals are all seated. When everything is assembled hub, rotor and caliper are dead nuts on where the should be. The hub isn't deep enough to put the seal where it needs to be on the spindle. Seal just barely touches face of machined area on spindle. I have sent a ton of e mails with pictures to Scarebird with nothing being resolved. I have started a claim tonight with Pay Pal and will contact Master Card tomorrow. I've been restoring and building cars for 40 years and know what's right and what's wrong. Also know when I'm being led on .

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I have to ask even though I am sure you checked, but is the bearing race seated at it's furthest depth? Verify that the correct bearing and race is installed could well be a slight difference in year application where one bearing may be a bit thicker than another..

Yes everything is seated as described above, bearing and hub goes all the way on the spindle. You can see in the picture of the seal installed in the hub it's almost against the inner bearing

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yes...and I have never used a kit by them...I must ask again..is there a possibility that there are two application of bearings that can be used with the hub..maybe a set with less thickness allowing for better seating on the spindle...even with a few pictures..we shooting from the hip out here in reader-land with a blindfold on to boot.

 

do you still have the boxes with the bearing and race numbers on them..and did the bearing seat flush with the race...

 

 

outside of that it seems to be a quality control problem that best may be handled by Scarebird techs...

Edited by Plymouthy Adams
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yes...and I have never used a kit by them...I must ask again..is there a possibility that there are two application of bearings that can be used with the hub..maybe a set with less thickness allowing for better seating on the spindle...even with a few pictures..we shooting from the hip out here in reader-land with a blindfold on to boot.

 

 

outside of that it seems to be a quality control problem that best may be handled by Scarebird techs...

I was hoping Scarebird techs would solve the problem. Most I can get from the is 3 or 4 word sentences which doesn't address the problem. The bearings are supplied by Scarebird with the races installed in the hub by Scarebird. That being said I don't know if another bearing can be used. The designed this kit and says it fits but it won't. I'll add all e mail s soon it's rather long. I'll most likely contact Rusty Hope tomorrow. The car has been on my lift for a month. I need to get brakes on it and move on.

Dave

Dave

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unfortunately that is the answer you got from them..a few people have run the gauntlet with them in the past on various problems..it is a shame..not sure anyone here will have your answer..if it is a machined hub they provide..maybe it was not cut to correct depth at the processing facility...ask them what the cut for the rear bearing depth should be ....that should get a definitive answer so you can can say yeah or nay to production error..

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Start at the bottom to read all correspondence

We checked - the seal should fit.

Scarebird Classic Brakes

PO Box 2522

Lynnwood, WA 98036

 

www.scarebird.com

sales@scarebird.com

tech@scarebird.com

----- Original Message -----

From: Dave Cunningham

To: <scarebird@frontier.com>

Sent: Monday, October 12, 2015 1:18 PM

Subject: Re: 1946-52 PLYMOUTH DELUXE, SPECIAL, P15, DODGE W/10" DRUM FRONT DISC

Anything yet, I'd like to get the car back on all 4

Dave

Sent from my iPad

On Oct 7, 2015, at 6:09 PM, <scarebird@frontier.com> wrote:

we have not got to it yet.

 

Scarebird Classic Brakes

PO Box 2522

Lynnwood, WA 98036

 

www.scarebird.com

sales@scarebird.com

tech@scarebird.com

----- Original Message -----

From: Dave Cunningham

To: <scarebird@frontier.com>

Sent: Wednesday, October 07, 2015 9:44 AM

Subject: Re: 1946-52 PLYMOUTH DELUXE, SPECIAL, P15, DODGE W/10" DRUM FRONT DISC

Have you been able to check your new stock order to see of the hubs are correct

Dave

Sent from my iPhone

On Sep 25, 2015, at 2:50 PM, <scarebird@frontier.com> <scarebird@frontier.com> wrote:

Will do. Thank you for your patience.

Scarebird Classic Brakes

PO Box 2522

Lynnwood, WA 98036

 

www.scarebird.com

sales@scarebird.com

tech@scarebird.com

----- Original Message -----

From: Dave Cunningham

To: <scarebird@frontier.com>

Sent: Friday, September 25, 2015 11:35 AM

Subject: Re: 1946-52 PLYMOUTH DELUXE, SPECIAL, P15, DODGE W/10" DRUM FRONT DISC

Ok keep me updated

Thanks Dave

Sent from my iPhone

On Sep 25, 2015, at 2:26 PM, <scarebird@frontier.com> <scarebird@frontier.com> wrote:

Dimensionally, the seal should fit.

 

Currently, all hubs are out of stock. Expecting order to arrive the week of the 5th (eta from supplier is the 7th).

 

We will then be able to verify fit.

Scarebird Classic Brakes

PO Box 2522

Lynnwood, WA 98036

 

www.scarebird.com

sales@scarebird.com

tech@scarebird.com

----- Original Message -----

From: Dave Cunningham

To: <scarebird@frontier.com>

Sent: Friday, September 25, 2015 10:53 AM

Subject: Re: 1946-52 PLYMOUTH DELUXE, SPECIAL, P15, DODGE W/10" DRUM FRONT DISC

Aluminum

Sent from my iPhone

On Sep 25, 2015, at 1:51 PM, <scarebird@frontier.com> <scarebird@frontier.com> wrote:

Dave,

 

Which hub cast or aluminum?

 

 

Scarebird Classic Brakes

PO Box 2522

Lynnwood, WA 98036

 

www.scarebird.com

sales@scarebird.com

tech@scarebird.com

----- Original Message -----

From: Dave Cunningham

To: <scarebird@frontier.com>

Sent: Friday, September 25, 2015 10:20 AM

Subject: Re: 1946-52 PLYMOUTH DELUXE, SPECIAL, P15, DODGE W/10" DRUM FRONT DISC

17415 as per the instruction in the kit

Dave

Sent from my iPad

On Sep 25, 2015, at 1:18 PM, <scarebird@frontier.com> wrote:

Dave,

 

What seal are you using?

 

Cast or aluminum hub?

 

Engineer is on vacation for another week, back on the week of October 5th. Looking to see if we can resolve without him.

 

Cheers,

Scarebird Classic Brakes

PO Box 2522

Lynnwood, WA 98036

 

www.scarebird.com

sales@scarebird.com

tech@scarebird.com

----- Original Message -----

From: Dave Cunningham

To: <scarebird@frontier.com>

Sent: Thursday, September 24, 2015 2:28 PM

Subject: Re: 1946-52 PLYMOUTH DELUXE, SPECIAL, P15, DODGE W/10" DRUM FRONT DISC

Thank you for looking into this issue, any idea on a time frame.

Thanks again Dave

Sent from my iPad

On Sep 24, 2015, at 5:26 PM, <scarebird@frontier.com> wrote:

We have asked our engineer to evaluate.

 

Scarebird Classic Brakes

PO Box 2522

Lynnwood, WA 98036

 

www.scarebird.com

sales@scarebird.com

tech@scarebird.com

----- Original Message -----

From: Dave Cunningham

To: <scarebird@frontier.com>

Sent: Thursday, September 24, 2015 2:02 PM

Subject: Re: 1946-52 PLYMOUTH DELUXE, SPECIAL, P15, DODGE W/10" DRUM FRONT DISC

What are we going to do to correct this issue. Everything lines up as it should except the inner hub isn't deep enough to place the inner seal over the seal area of spindle.

Dave

Sent from my iPad

On Sep 23, 2015, at 7:56 PM, <scarebird@frontier.com> wrote:

Dave,

 

From the photo it looks like the hub is on reversed.

 

See if these photos help.

 

Cheers,

Scarebird Classic Brakes

PO Box 2522

Lynnwood, WA 98036

 

www.scarebird.com

sales@scarebird.com

tech@scarebird.com

----- Original Message -----

From: Dave Cunningham

To: <scarebird@frontier.com>

Sent: Tuesday, September 22, 2015 5:03 PM

Subject: Re: 1946-52 PLYMOUTH DELUXE, SPECIAL, P15, DODGE W/10" DRUM FRONT DISC

Ok

The hubs are installed on my spindles, inner bearing is all the way on the spindle and seated. My concern is the bearing doesn't ride very deep in the hub. Once the seal is installed the seal lip is almost touching the bearing. The seal just barely touches the sealing area on the spindle. There about a 3/8" gap between hub and seal area on the spindle. I'm concerned about grease being slung out and getting onto the rotors and pads. 

Dave

<image.jpeg>

Sent from my iPad

On Sep 21, 2015, at 4:47 PM, <scarebird@frontier.com> wrote:

Dave,

 

Then use this information sheet.

 

Cheers,

Scarebird Classic Brakes

PO Box 2522

Lynnwood, WA 98036

 

www.scarebird.com

sales@scarebird.com

tech@scarebird.com

----- Original Message -----

From: Dave Cunningham

To: <scarebird@frontier.com>

Sent: Monday, September 21, 2015 11:54 AM

Subject: Re: 1946-52 PLYMOUTH DELUXE, SPECIAL, P15, DODGE W/10" DRUM FRONT DISC

Aluminum

Sent from my iPhone

On Sep 21, 2015, at 2:56 PM, <scarebird@frontier.com> <scarebird@frontier.com> wrote:

Dave,

 

What style of hub was sent cast or aluminum?

 

Scarebird Classic Brakes

PO Box 2522

Lynnwood, WA 98036

 

www.scarebird.com

sales@scarebird.com

tech@scarebird.com

----- Original Message -----

From: Dave Cunningham

To: <scarebird@frontier.com>

Sent: Saturday, September 19, 2015 1:09 PM

Subject: Re: 1946-52 PLYMOUTH DELUXE, SPECIAL, P15, DODGE W/10" DRUM FRONT DISC

Received the kit today, all looks good. Slight bit of confusion, I received two instruction sheets. On step 5 one instruction sheet mentions using bearing spacers the other does not mention anything about spacers. There are no spacers in my kit. Am I missing the spacers or do I not not need them. I ordered the kit for the 10" drums.

Thanks Dave

Sent from my iPad

On Sep 16, 2015, at 1:20 PM, <scarebird@frontier.com> wrote:

Dave,

 

Will ship today.

 

Cheers,

Scarebird Classic Brakes

PO Box 2522

Lynnwood, WA 98036

 

www.scarebird.com

sales@scarebird.com

tech@scarebird.com

----- Original Message -----

From: Dave Cunningham

To: <scarebird@frontier.com>

Sent: Wednesday, September 16, 2015 5:54 AM

Subject: Re: 1946-52 PLYMOUTH DELUXE, SPECIAL, P15, DODGE W/10" DRUM FRONT DISC

Has the kit been shipped

Thanks Dave

Sent from my iPhone

On Sep 10, 2015, at 12:01 PM, <scarebird@frontier.com> <scarebird@frontier.com> wrote:

thanks.

 

Scarebird Classic Brakes

PO Box 2522

Lynnwood, WA 98036

 

www.scarebird.com

sales@scarebird.com

tech@scarebird.com

----- Original Message -----

From: Dave Cunningham

To: <scarebird@frontier.com>

Sent: Wednesday, September 09, 2015 7:01 PM

Subject: Re: 1946-52 PLYMOUTH DELUXE, SPECIAL, P15, DODGE W/10" DRUM FRONT DISC

Thanks for answering all my question, ordered the kit for my 49 Dodge Wayfarer 

Dave

Thank you for your interest in Scarebird Classic Brakes LLC products. Your order has been received and will be processed once payment has been confirmed.

To view your order click on the link below:

http://scarebird.com/index.php?route=account/order/info&order_id=3076

Order Details

Order ID: 3076

Date Added: 09/09/2015

Payment Method: PayPal

On Sep 5, 2015, at 6:29 PM, <scarebird@frontier.com> wrote:

If you run across something better on the MC end give me a yell...

Scarebird Classic Brakes

PO Box 2522

Lynnwood, WA 98036

 

www.scarebird.com

sales@scarebird.com

tech@scarebird.com

----- Original Message -----

From: Dave Cunningham

To: <scarebird@frontier.com>

Sent: Saturday, September 05, 2015 3:25 PM

Subject: Re: 1946-52 PLYMOUTH DELUXE, SPECIAL, P15, DODGE W/10" DRUM FRONT DISC

ECI I've read some negative remarks on their MC kit. Read a lot of positive comments on your kit. I'm doing some more research on the mc issue

Thanks again for the help Dave

Sent from my iPhone

On Sep 5, 2015, at 6:20 PM, <scarebird@frontier.com> <scarebird@frontier.com> wrote:

 

 

This is getting confusing. I understand you don't have a master cylinder for you kit.

 

correct - the master is also the pivot for the clutch - making it quite expensive to repop.  There is one master kit out there that goes dual; I was not impressed and will not refer it.

 

You supply a list as to what calipers and rotors etc to use. I need to know what master cylinder will work with the calipers that fit your brackets.

 

we designed it so the stock master will work - single res masters do indeed work and have been used by the OEMS before the DOT made everybody go dual in 1967

  

Thanks for your time Dave

Sent from my iPad

On Sep 5, 2015, at 5:21 PM, <scarebird@frontier.com> wrote:

as stated, that will be custom, something we do not have.

Scarebird Classic Brakes

PO Box 2522

Lynnwood, WA 98036

 

www.scarebird.com

sales@scarebird.com

tech@scarebird.com

----- Original Message -----

From: Dave Cunningham

To: <scarebird@frontier.com>

Sent: Saturday, September 05, 2015 2:17 PM

Subject: Re: 1946-52 PLYMOUTH DELUXE, SPECIAL, P15, DODGE W/10" DRUM FRONT DISC

I dont want to use the stock 1949 Dodge single master cyl. I want to use a dual master cyl for safety. Do you know what master cyl is compatible with the calipers you suggest to use with your kit. 

Sent from my iPad

On Sep 5, 2015, at 5:10 PM, <scarebird@frontier.com> wrote:

The stock one will work if the residual valve is pulled, otherwise you will need a custom setup.

 

Scarebird Classic Brakes

PO Box 2522

Lynnwood, WA 98036

 

www.scarebird.com

sales@scarebird.com

tech@scarebird.com

----- Original Message -----

From: Dave Cunningham

To: <scarebird@frontier.com>

Sent: Saturday, September 05, 2015 9:28 AM

Subject: Re: 1946-52 PLYMOUTH DELUXE, SPECIAL, P15, DODGE W/10" DRUM FRONT DISC

Ok . I want to buy this kit but I'm trying to figure out what master cylinder to use that would be compatible with the required calipers rotors etc. Any suggestions

Thanks Dave

Sent from my iPad

On Aug 31, 2015, at 12:06 PM, <scarebird@frontier.com> wrote:

no,

 

Scarebird Classic Brakes

PO Box 2522

Lynnwood, WA 98036

 

www.scarebird.com

sales@scarebird.com

tech@scarebird.com

----- Original Message -----

From: Dave Cunningham

To: sales@scarebird.com

Sent: Sunday, August 30, 2015 5:29 PM

Subject: 1946-52 PLYMOUTH DELUXE, SPECIAL, P15, DODGE W/10" DRUM FRONT DISC

Do you have a master cylinder kit that is compatible the 1946-52 PLYMOUTH DELUXE, SPECIAL, P15, DODGE W/10" DRUM FRONT DISC kit

Thanks Dave

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Once again, take the bearings out and measure the depth of the steps in the hub. Just because they supplied the hub does not mean it is machined correctly. If you give their tech department those measurements and it matches their specs, however far it goes on, even if just a little bit, it's correct.

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Once again, take the bearings out and measure the depth of the steps in the hub. Just because they supplied the hub does not mean it is machined correctly. If you give their tech department those measurements and it matches their specs, however far it goes on, even if just a little bit, it's correct.

Ok

1. When I send them an e mail they take a day or 2 to respond

2. If you call their phone number all you get is an answering machine

I agree on taking measurements but I would think they would contact me asking for such. Read the above e mails you'll see what I'm dealing with in their tech department. All the want to do is side step the issue. I have left them my phone number on their answering machine and in e mail. I'm done, they can call me or deal with Pay Pal and Master Card.

Edited by Branded
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I do not think I would have communicated beyond their first reply....would never have committed to an order...

Wished I hadn't, hind sight is 20/20

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Once again, take the bearings out and measure the depth of the steps in the hub. Just because they supplied the hub does not mean it is machined correctly. If you give their tech department those measurements and it matches their specs, however far it goes on, even if just a little bit, it's correct.

Just thinking about your statement, if you reposition the inner bearing to allow the hub and seal to go farther onto the spindle this will also change the position of the rotor in relationship with the caliper. As stated earlier and what I've tried explaining to Scarebird is the hub isn't deep enough on the back side. Everything is where it needs to be except for the seal. Hub needs to be 1/4" deeper on the backside

Edited by Branded
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Finally solved the problem I believe, Scarebird sent me a message to try a different seal. The seal sticks out past the hub and located the seal lip further on to the spindle seal surface. Will find out in the spring if this seal works. The kit from Scarebird fit very well except for the seal issue. Trying to get answers when you have issues are slow. They don't answer their phone and will not return calls when leaving an message on their answering machine. If I had it to do over I'd take my business elsewhere.

Dave

Edited by Branded
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