ggdad1951 Posted May 13, 2011 Report Share Posted May 13, 2011 ok, call me crazy (some of you already have), but I was wrenching last night putting on the flywheel cover and the dust cover and I saw several "leaks". My oil drain plug seems to want to weep a little, snugged it a little more, but I don't want to wrench that too tight. And my tranny really seems to want to have weep leaks out of every bolt hole that penetrates to the fluid. On the tranny a few I pulled out when I drained it and put some thread sealer on, but they still seem a bit "glisteny" in the tight spaces. Mayhap the seals just need to get good and soaked? Or is this just what I have to expect? My first thought this shouldn't happen with fresh rebuilds.... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TodFitch Posted May 13, 2011 Report Share Posted May 13, 2011 My engine leaks more after it was rebuilt than it did before. Unfortunately the main culprit seems to be in the area of the chain case in front. And to get to that I have to pretty much pull the whole front end of the car apart. I do wish I'd been as smart as Don Coatney and run the engine on a stand first to check for issues and fix them before the engine went back into the car. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NiftyFifty Posted May 13, 2011 Report Share Posted May 13, 2011 No you should have any leaks, and you shouldn't have worse leaks. I'm guessing the culpret is bad or cheap gaskets. If your using a lot of cork or paper gaskets your going to have issues. The drain plug most likely needs a new gasket, might just be a copper washer on that, and your trans bolts...you should drain all the fuild out and put a good rubber gasket in. You don't want to end up low on trans fluid, or end up with the bottom side of the vehicle covered in oil....weeping at a stand still or even warm when it's new gaskets will lead to major issues down the road. Also use some ultra black on those bolts when you put them in and allow them at least 5 or 6 hours to dry before you add the fluid and start driving. When I was working at the shop we always used to go for the best rubber gaskets, use some rtv and actually window trim adhesive in some cases to stick gaskets in the right place before we installed....then they don't move on you and cause issues...nothing fun about doing a job twice like that. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dave72dt Posted May 13, 2011 Report Share Posted May 13, 2011 Leaks aren't supposed to be there. Paper gaskets work fine, just need a quality sealer. Cork gaskets dry out over time and shrink, are often over tightened when installed. The cover plates used may have depressed bolt holes from tightening and will end up damaging the gasket. Both surfaces the gasket sits on need to be flat. I'm not an advocate of RTV. I've seen it end up in places it shouldn't be but used sparingly and correctly, it works. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NiftyFifty Posted May 13, 2011 Report Share Posted May 13, 2011 Leaks aren't supposed to be there. Paper gaskets work fine, just need a quality sealer. Cork gaskets dry out over time and shrink, are often over tightened when installed. The cover plates used may have depressed bolt holes from tightening and will end up damaging the gasket. Both surfaces the gasket sits on need to be flat. I'm not an advocate of RTV. I've seen it end up in places it shouldn't be but used sparingly and correctly, it works. careful what you use for "sealer", stuff like permatex aviation gasket makes or (bear crap) as we like to call it, will harden and make your next gasket job twice as bad, so only use it on a surface that's easy to clean and easy to dissasemble. Paper is fine for stuff like thermostat gaskets and carb intake gaskets, but I don't have much use for it in other spots. FelPro makes some of the best gaskets I've found...and a rubber valve cover gasket is a must Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dave72dt Posted May 13, 2011 Report Share Posted May 13, 2011 I actually like and prefer aviation sealer along with non hardening "bear crap' for corners and seams. Others prefer spray-on sealers or RTV. I find the aviation has easy cleanup of excess on joints, seals better than the spray-ons and easier to remove from gasket surfaces than RTV. When in business, redoing work because of leaks is a no-profit use of time. JMO but use whatever system works for you and you're most comfortable using. Regardless, all gasket surfaces need to be clean and flat for best sealing and all threaded through holes with liquid behind them need to be sealed. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ggdad1951 Posted May 13, 2011 Author Report Share Posted May 13, 2011 I actually like and prefer aviation sealer along with non hardening "bear crap' for corners and seams. Others prefer spray-on sealers or RTV. I find the aviation has easy cleanup of excess on joints, seals better than the spray-ons and easier to remove from gasket surfaces than RTV. When in business, redoing work because of leaks is a no-profit use of time.JMO but use whatever system works for you and you're most comfortable using. Regardless, all gasket surfaces need to be clean and flat for best sealing and all threaded through holes with liquid behind them need to be sealed. Well, when I get home form work today, I'll flop on the creeper and see what I see again, if I see leaks still, I'll call up Zumbrota B&G and ask what they heck they did! As long as they don't say to remove the tranny and bring it i! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
John-T-53 Posted May 13, 2011 Report Share Posted May 13, 2011 PTFE thread tape works great for things like drain and fill plugs, and bolts too. I've used RTV and Permatex #2 on threaded connections over the years and got the best results after switching to PTFE. Especially on head bolts. These engines will always leak, new or old. From the start after my rebuild, this included the front and rear seals, and a little at the timing cover. The side valve covers also seal up completely with a very thin coat of blue RTV between the cork gasket and the block. If you wipe the block clean with a rag, leaving a slight oil cast on the surface, it'll make removing the covers a lot easier in the future (for adjusting valves). Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Desotodav Posted May 13, 2011 Report Share Posted May 13, 2011 I've got the same oil leaks as you by the sound of it Mark. I too would have thought that after spending a considerable amount on reconditioning the mechanical parts on my truck that I shouldn't see oil spots on the garage floor, but maybe it's just the way things are with these old vehicles? After working on my weeping oil issues, I still have a slight weep from the bottom of the timing chain cover, a weep from somewhere in the front of the gearbox, and now a new weep from the speedo cable at the gearbox end. I'm hoping that they will be less noticeable after I change out the 'running in' oil after I clock up a few hundred more miles. Let me know if you find a solution to the problem as I would be very interested in waving that same magic wand at my truck. Desotodav Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dodgeb4ya Posted May 13, 2011 Report Share Posted May 13, 2011 I don't think you will ever see a perfect leak free MoPar flathead six- an eight maybe. I've never seen one! 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dave72dt Posted May 13, 2011 Report Share Posted May 13, 2011 I don't think you will ever see a perfect leak free MoPar flathead six- an eight maybe. I've never seen one! There were a number of different brands and types of motorized equipment we applied the saying " If it's not leaking, it's out of oil". Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Scruffy49 Posted May 14, 2011 Report Share Posted May 14, 2011 Reminds me of a helicopter pilot friend... "If the fitting is dry, you're about to die". Apparently NOTHING leaks like Chinook helicopter hydraulics (except British motorcycles and my Dodges). I'd say my 49 has leaked oil since the day it left the factory, there is over a half inch of goo built up on the differential, axle tubes, front axle, steering box. My 69 leaks so much that I ended up grease packing the steering box. They are Mopars, they leak. Part of their charm. Glad I have gravel driveways. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NiftyFifty Posted May 14, 2011 Report Share Posted May 14, 2011 Reminds me of a helicopter pilot friend... "If the fitting is dry, you're about to die". Apparently NOTHING leaks like Chinook helicopter hydraulics (except British motorcycles and my Dodges).I'd say my 49 has leaked oil since the day it left the factory, there is over a half inch of goo built up on the differential, axle tubes, front axle, steering box. My 69 leaks so much that I ended up grease packing the steering box. They are Mopars, they leak. Part of their charm. Glad I have gravel driveways. There are always ways to stop any leak...most guys just deal with it, but I'd rather take a few extra steps and make sure it doesn't rather then just accepting it. When you work at a shop you can't just tell customers, "be worried when it stops leaking" they expect things to get fixed...weaping...slightly acceptable...leaks..can be fixed Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dave72dt Posted May 14, 2011 Report Share Posted May 14, 2011 I don't know any customer who would accept and pay for work that came back from the shop leaking from the repaired area. Reputable shops do their best to prevent such occurances but it's really tough to do when it's returned dry. For the DYIers it's even harder because assembly practices the shops would use may be unknown or skipped over. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dodgeb4ya Posted May 14, 2011 Report Share Posted May 14, 2011 How many people here after 5000 miles have absolute leak free flatheads and will show and be honest about it? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dave72dt Posted May 14, 2011 Report Share Posted May 14, 2011 I think they'll all develop leaks but a fresh rebuilt shouldn't start with them. I've never known any leak to get better with time. The rear engine seal might if it's a rope seal and swells up some. Most live with it leaking some because of the time and expense to repair it is and no garauntee it won't leak as bad or worse afterwards. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dodgeb4ya Posted May 14, 2011 Report Share Posted May 14, 2011 They all will leak just a small leak-maybe a drip after parking for several hours. The engine should not burn or use any (1 Quart) oil on a good rebuild even after 2500 miles or more. Thats my experience on all mine. But I don't think you can make a flathead leak free like any of the current GM's/Fords or Hondas ect. that are dry as a bone after 100,000 miles and perfectly leak free. Modern technology-quite amazing! Bob 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dave72dt Posted May 14, 2011 Report Share Posted May 14, 2011 PCV systems, gasket design, cover and pan design, seal design and material, engine design all play a part. My daily didn't start using (losing ) oil until after 190k.. Dry as a bone until the front seal started weeping. Rear seal, transmision and diffs still dry and just rolled over 200k this spring. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dodgeb4ya Posted May 14, 2011 Report Share Posted May 14, 2011 My Toyo Tacoma after 205,000 still has no leaks-lotsa oil changes/good maintenence made this possible. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dave72dt Posted May 14, 2011 Report Share Posted May 14, 2011 Mine 's an F-250 4wd extended cab, longbed with the 7.5L gas engine. Bought it as a rebuildable salvage with 135k on it. Best starting coldweather truck I've ever had. Not the best starting engine I've had, best starting truck. It's only failed me twice in 12 years. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ggdad1951 Posted May 14, 2011 Author Report Share Posted May 14, 2011 after creeping last night is seems like I really only have 1 "bad" weeper. But I want to run the engine again first to make sure nothing else is weeping before I drain and such. Oil pan leak seems to be taken care of with the snugging I did, and I'm sure it's the be copper washers. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JBNeal Posted May 14, 2011 Report Share Posted May 14, 2011 I reckon Chrysler accepted that the rear main seal was not going to be leak-free early on. Consider the flywheel cover area. One cover has a strip of cotton fiber that all its good for is soaking up oil & dirt. I've known many a tractor & old truck that didn't leak until somebody decided to clean off all the greasy crud. Maybe the engineers back in the day counted on any leak to plug up with dust. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
John-T-53 Posted May 14, 2011 Report Share Posted May 14, 2011 One leak I finally did fix was the diff pinion seal. I used to have to dump a quart or so into the pumpkin about every month, and the asphalt under where I park turned to goo (and stinks). With a speedy sleeve and a new leather seal, it's finally cured. I had doubts about the 'cow' material but it seems to be doing its job so far, about 1000 miles. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ggdad1951 Posted May 15, 2011 Author Report Share Posted May 15, 2011 ran the engine again today up to temp so I could re-torque the head bolts and it seems I have taken care of a most of the leaks. I still have one bolt on the tranny that I'll have to drain the tranny down again. And I'm hoping the coolant weeping out the edges of the head will now stop with the hot torque. Even my oil pan seems to be behaving as well as my oil filter after I poked at it again. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MarkAubuchon Posted May 16, 2011 Report Share Posted May 16, 2011 Come on Guys. Admit it! Everything over 60 years old leaks and drips a little ! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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