Metal garage/shop buildings

[Normspeed]

I hope to get a metal building installed at my place. I'm not real savvy on building requirements and techniques like pouring slabs, so I'll probably sub out the work to one or more local contractors. Looking for any thoughts or comments from people who have gone through the process. I haven't chosen a brand yet (seems like there are tons of them out there).

I plan on something in the 30 X 40 sq ft size, on a slab, with electric. Also I'd like to build one area high enough for a 2 post lift to operate. Any thoughts on that would be appreciated too.

How many amps should I be going for on a single phase shop electric panel?

Also, from folks who know financing, how would you finance something like this in the current economic market, if you were going to build one? 2nd mortgage, spend some 401k money, (avoid the interest but pay the taxes on it), or??

All suggestions welcomed.

[Plymouthy Adams]

I find that 13 feet is the minimum height for the 4 post lift and being able to run a mini van to the top and have clearance at the roof..that is the height I built my ceiling...

if getting a prefab metal building..be careful of bait and switch or the customized approach..deviate form their offered bait plan and you now go off the wall high cost custom plan...I found this correct in 5 out 5 metal building sellers...why I went build it myself...

Edited December 26, 2009 by Tim Adams

[dparksie]

The height you need is 13-14'. Since the standard is even numbers go 14' The slab has to be 12" thick under all the posts for the wedge bolts used to attach the posts to the floor. Most post lifts require 220 volt 30 amp so single phase 150 to 200 amp for the building is more than enough depending on the compressor size and if you are going to heat the building.

Stick to standard off the shelve plans, much easier and cheaper. Don't know your codes but you will probably need a survey of what you have and where you plan to put the building.

For financing: do not touch your 401 at this point I would go with 2nd mortgage if you can swing it. The interest rate right now is cheap so if you can go that route and the money stays around to get more toys to put in the building.

You need anything let me know I'll help anyway I can.

Don P

[PatS....]

Some good info here. Where I live, code doesn't allow metal buildings in residential. Just something to check.

http://www.garagejournal.com/forum/

[Reg Evans]

I've had 3 of these (see link below)type structures built because I found I could get the most sq. footage under roof for the least amount of dollars. You can design and order just about anything you can dream up and do it on line before you even call them. Any concrete work will have to be done by others. Call around and get the best price for that or get some buddies together and do that part yourself.

http://www.carports.com/

Here's the last one I had built. They are so affordable that you can't afford to do it yourself. I think the max width is 30'. This one was only 26' wide.

As for ceiling height mine at 12' off the slab has been tall enough for every car or truck I've needed to get under.

[Plymouthy Adams]

our available shop height may be that of the supplier more than your wnat...it is this that gets the high dollar custom pricing..

If restricted as Pat say he is..I got 13 feet by laying up a row of block (8 inch) on my slab, given the sill, top and cap plate you get another 4 1/2"' and go with stand 12 foot timber you get 13' 1'' and then time you finish the inside with 1/4 panel and fir-strip the seams..you be back to 13 feet with all standard material and very little waste anywhere..

[dparksie]

I just did a quick check of the codes in your city. While I don't know the exact zone you are in I did not not see any stops in any zone against metal buildings:). About the only thing they had was that the building could be no more than 30% of the rear yard and you have to watch the separation distance from the house, fire code that one.

Don P

[Normspeed]

Great info. I'll definitely need to check with the code folks first. The area is almost all agricultural around my house so metal outbuildings are everywhere. Anyone familiar with the dealers who offer to take it through the whole process from permits to final assembly? Probably pricey I guess.

I haven't begun asking for package prices yet, as each company wants a lot of contact info, which I don't like to give out easily. Thought I might narrow them down first.

About 2 years back I called one metal building place that advertised on TV, I won't give the name but the first word was "American". They mentioned proudly that their products were "American made". I called their 800 number and was connected to a nice chap somewhere in India who wanted to get me in touch with a project specialist. I politely declined, but I thought the irony of it was pretty funny.

Keep those suggestions coming. This will need to be en enclosed structure because of the high winds and blowing debris in the desert. Reg, that big shelter would be a great sun cover out here. The UV can eat up a car's interior or a cover pretty fast.

I'm in Luna County, outside city limits.

[RobertKB]

Two recommendations I can make. One, build it bigger than you think you will need as any garage or shop is never big enough. Two, put in lots, I mean lots, of good lighting. You can have the lights on several switches and only light what you want but there are times when you need LOTS of light and it is nice to have it when needed. Good luck with your project. It sounds great. My garage is 22' X 36' and I wish it was bigger.

[Norm's Coupe]

As far as the building goes, I'll leave that to others. I have not built one of those buildings. But........when it comes to electrical, I'd go with at least 110 volt split up on two or more 20amp circuits in the garage. Also, if you already have a contractor doing the work, it's not that much more to run a 220 volt line at the same time. You may not need the 220 circuit now, but if you decide to run a heater or some tool in the future, it will come in handy. A 110/115 heater will not heat a garage, you'll need that 220/240 line.

You are already retired. But......whatever money you draw out of your 401 will count as income on your taxes. Depending on your tax bracket and financial folio you could end up paying around 40 to 45% in taxes on what you draw out. In short, if you took $10,000, you'd have to pay uncle Sam roughly $4,000 or more in income tax. Not only that, but if you took early retirement and are under your full retirement age, you may even have to pay back part of your monthly social security check to the IRS come tax time. So.........taking large sums out all at once from a 401 can cost you big time. May be best to take out a loan and pay the interest on it. So.....that part is hard for any of us to answer. It's best to talk with your accountant, or your bank representative. They are better equipped to answer that question since they know your financial situation.

Edited December 24, 2009 by Norm's Coupe

[49DODGEBOY]

well I,m no expert but when I researched and built mine I had plenty to learn, one, build as big as possible (money wise and fit wise). Work with the code people, steel buildings were not alowed on anything less than an acre where I am. Mine was .98, I went to the planning Dept, found this nice old guy who dug up my original plot plan filed by the builder, guess what, 1.12 was on the plan, taking consideration for the street. I got a copy, took it to planning and they could not say no.

In a nutshell, I built a 50 x 40 with 14ft walls. Why 14? to fit the tallest roll up door I could. I have two 16w x 12 tall doors, set up so I can go thru, although one had to be out on the side, it works great. Insulate the roof at least! I had them put the insulation in with the silver side towards the steel, putting the white side down, with the lights on the reflection off the white really brightens things up, and the look is cleaner. I also refused to let them put those fiberglass windows on the roof, I had them install them on the sides, they let light in but are out of the sun so they won't yellow or crack.

Pay the extra $ for good cement work, a smooth clean floor is nice to have. Vent it, really helps in the summer.

With the economy down watch Craigslist for stores closing, I got some really great store lights from a Staples.

I,ll post a couple of pics, you will see that mine is quite high off the ground, I had a two foot fall in the property front to back, so I went up off the dirt.

one quick note, when the builder orders your building, he gets steel panals for the entire building, when they account for the door space, all the extra steel belongs to you, keep it! I,ve built a hay shed cover, corral walls etc.

Counting the camper, horse trailer etc I have 7 vehicles inside right now with extra room for three work benches, a desk couch, and a universal weight machine for my boys.....and I have the greatest wife in the world for letting me build it!

http://photos-e.ak.fbcdn.net/hphotos-ak-snc3/hs052.snc3/13956_100586679967629_100000488921189_12277_2869093_n.jpg

http://photos-f.ak.fbcdn.net/hphotos-ak-snc3/hs072.snc3/13956_100586683300962_100000488921189_12278_2502760_n.jpg

http://photos-h.ak.fbcdn.net/hphotos-ak-snc3/hs072.snc3/13956_100591929967104_100000488921189_12406_5265283_n.jpg

Edited December 24, 2009 by 49DODGEBOY

[Oldguy48]

A suggestion I can offer you is to install a 100 amp service (at a minimum) in your new garage. Even a 200 amp service would not be overkill. Operating a large welder, or large air compressor, etc. requires 220 volt circuits. You'll never be sorry if you spend the extra money for an adequate electrical system.

And although I'm not familiar with the climate in your particular neck of the woods, if you think you'll need to heat the building, there are heating systems that are incorporated into the concrete slab. Electrical heating elements that are embedded in the concrete. If heating is a consideration, it would be worthwhile to check that out. And I'm certain that they require 220 volts to operate. And good luck with your project. I wish I had the real estate to construct a building like that.

[greg g]

If you are not set into steel, ask around to see if there are any Menonite or Amish groups in your area. Around here they build really nice storage sheds, gazebos and garages. But lately they are also working on post and beam style buildings and Pole style buildings. Thee is one group here that does post and beam 40 x 40 wood, with a 12 foot interior height, and a couple courses of block would raise that, for 10,900 with standard hardware and fitting windows and man door included, owner provides overhead

or they wil put sliding style barn door on for extra. One group says they can put up a standard 2 car garage on a ready slab in 2 days for 6900.

Somebody just shot out ~$25 per square ft for the building and ~3.50 per square fot for the reniforced concrete floor.

[Robert Horne]

I designed and built my shop 36 x 32, 2x4s, use vinyl siding to match my home. 200 amp service does not cost much more that 100 amp. A mobile home electric furnace makes a good heating system.

Helped 2 of my uncles with their shops, with metal buildings, which was alot easier to put up. One shop we did with a garage door at each end, like a drive through. The air flow in the summer is great. A couple of skylights in my shop is going in this spring. I just can not get enough light any more.

[Harvey Tank]

a lot of good advice here! about the onlything I could advise is who ever you contract the conc. slab out to, make darn sure they put a vopor barrier under the conc. visquen is cheap. its a must. I dan't care what part of the country you live in. good luck on you project

Edited December 24, 2009 by ruth1932

[Robert Horne]

Yes, that vapor barrier is a big plus. I put in a center drain, drain in the lower corner also, water hose connections at each end. From the rear to the front, I have about a 2 inch drop, and a downward tapper in front of the doors to keep out blowing rain. The concrete crew did a good job on my slab, put in cut scores to let the concrete crack where you want it to, and it will crack.

[Dennis Hemingway]

My Garage is 30' X 50' with 13' walls and 12' roll up doors. I have my 4 post lift in and can lift a car all the way up with on problems. I had a 200 amp elect service put in. I had 4 skylights put in so during the day I don't need lights and it is insulated so I can work out there in Winter or Summer. I thank my wife Kathy for my retirement present (so she can get me out of the house).

Dennis:cool:

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[49DODGEBOY]

Dennis

Looks like you and I have the same taste, and the same building MFR.

But yours is a hell of alot cleaner than mine....

and guys, don't forget rain gutters!

My Garage is 30' X 50' with 13' walls and 12' roll up doors. I have my 4 post lift in and can lift a car all the way up with on problems. I had a 200 amp elect service put in. I had 4 skylights put in so during the day I don't need lights and it is insulated so I can work out there in Winter or Summer. I thank my wife Kathy for my retirement present (so she can get me out of the house).

Dennis:cool:

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[Dennis Hemingway]

49DODGEBOY.

I got mine from FORBES Steel Buildings in Phelan, Ca.

Dennis:cool:

http://www.forbessteel.com/

[49DODGEBOY]

49DODGEBOY.

I got mine from FORBES Steel Buildings in Phelan, Ca.

Dennis:cool:

http://www.forbessteel.com/

Mine, Franklin Steel Buildings, here in Riverside.

Did pick up an ex-racehorse from a rescue out in Phelan though.

[greg g]

Norm, one other venue to check. The college I worked at had a residential building construction mamagment program. They were always looking for projects. They ae the ones who put my 2 9X12 storage sheds together for me. Cost me Materials, a bucnch of Pizza and beverages on assembly day, and a small contribution to the college which was deductable. They did the site plan design drawings, bill of materials. And prefabbed at their shop, then delivered and assembled the building on my gradded site.

It sitting on a compacted crushed stone pad with blocks at weight bearing boints, on a frame of doubled treated 2x 8. Floor is 3/4 treated plywood. The 2 9 x 12 are built really really close to one another. As a matter of fact they are touchig in a lot of places.

This cause I could build up to 100 sq feet without a permit, so I figured 2 9x12 really, really close together didn't need a permit either.

I believe my total cost was less than 3000.00 including the pizzas.

So check the community colleges and tech schools in your area.

[Bingster]

I built my own using a Menards standard plan. It is 20 ft. X about 50 ft. X 12 ft. tall. My wife helped. I built a jig crane on a small trailer with an electric winch to lift large parts and put them into place. Dug all the holes, poured cement by hand, etc. etc. I have not yet put in a cement florr, however. Haven't even used the building yet. It's been a few years. Long story. It was a lot of work but saved quite a bit.

[randroid]

Folks,

I'm curious as to why there's a question mark in a blue circle in this thread's topic. I won't lose any sleep over it but I don't think I've seen that before.

-Randy

[Plymouthy Adams]

Randy...when posting new thread the originator has the option of denoting the general gist of the thread..is this case, it is a question looking for answers...see list of thread icons at bottom when posting a thread..

[Dennis Hemingway]

That is because Normspeed clicked the Question Mark in the icon's before he posted this. That shows that this is thread is a question.

Dennis:cool: