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David Maxwell

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The following are screen captures from a 1954 film titled Magnificent Obsession, starring Jane Wyman and Rock Hudson. The film features a 1947/48 P15 Marine Blue 4-door sedan. The P15 shows up in several scenes. Once a random car and twice as a Taxi cab. The suction cups holding the taxi sign can be clearly seen explaining the easy removal for the other scene. What is notable is that both the exterior and interior are clearly seen in full color. I have argued with the POC over the correct fabric for the door panels on the 47-48 models. In the scoring guide, it suggests that all P15s had the pinstripe material on the lower portion of the door panel. This is INCORRECT!! Only the 1946 models had that. The 47-48 were solid wool on both portions. I have extensive literature and hundreds of photos to back that up. Now I have full color screen captures from a period film to add to my list of evidence. Regardless, the pictures are great to look at! Enjoy!!

FYI... In this scene, Jane Wyman is trying to escape from Rock Hudson. She exists the lefthand rear door and is struck by a passing car which leaves her blind.

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All well and good for standard P15 Special Deluxes, however, the Taxi versions were probably different. Typically the Interior trim in the Taxi optioned car were leather and or leatherette for long lasting durability. Would like to see a real P15 taxi with it likely more spartan interior dressing. Those pics are interesting for another reason. In the first you can see a Chevy, a Buick and a Studebaker parked in the background behind the "taxi" along with a Jaguar saloon. Parked in the background of the exit scene are three of those 4 cars parked in slightly different order. The Jag apparently didn't make the trasition. Also wonder why the impact to the door on the P15 strongenough to injure poor Jane wasn't even enough to damage the door.

Also any guesses as to what the car was that "hit" the taxi??? I'm going with 52 Ford station wagon.

David, 90% of the P15 I have seen including a few unrestored cars at POC meets here inthe east have unpatterned material onthe door panels. With the same material as on the lower seat frame on the 4 to 6 inches. I think you argument with the POC judging form is 100% meritoreous. But with their resistance to change, I doubt you can get anything done about it regardless of how much visual evidence you present in support of your position. Good luck.

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David,

When it comes to judging old cars of any kind in an original type club like the POC, they do not know all in their rule books.;) I've said that many times. After all, many of them were not even around when these cars were new. And, if they were they can't remember every detail that is not spelled out in official books, nor was all even in the books to look at. Myself included. I was around back then and rode in those cars. My parents and grandparents always had some sort of Mopar cars from the 40's on up. But..........I was too young to remember all that, nor did I really care at the ripe old age of 4 years old when my coupe was new in 1948. Even the people who are 10 years older than I can't remember all that either, nor did most care then either. All the original clubs say they are committed to "Preserving" the cars of the day. Yet, they did build hot rods and customs in those periods, just like they do today. But.......they were not like the dressed up street rods you see today, they were more like what people call "rat rods" today. So.....if they truly want to "Preserve" automotive history, they should include those rods and customs that are done with period correct accessories, because that is also truly part of automotive history.

Anyway, the next time you get in that discussion about door panels on the 47 - 48 Plymouth, here's a shot of mine. My coupe was all original when I bought it, and the door panel you see is the way it looked when I first bought the car. As you can see, it is just as you described. My coupe was actually built in late 1947 and sold first sold in February 1948 to the original owner. I have the records to that fact. Another interesting point (argument) with the POC when I was a member was the wheels. It originally had 16" wheels until I put 15" wheels on it. Since the car was first sold in 1948, it's officially a 48 car, not 47, because that's the way they were titled back then. Yet, the POC argues, they didn't have 16" wheels on a 48, and refuse to admit it. Yet, my coupe is proof of the fact that you can have 1948 Plymouth with 16" wheels. Or, at least it was until I changed them. With that in mind, they will probably say this door panel isn't original too.:rolleyes: Guess you can't educate people with closed minds though, even when they see it.

48Plymouth20.jpg

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A true taxi would have a different interior, but because this was only a mocked up taxi, it had the standard Special Deluxe interior. And yes, most cars you will see have the solid patterns and are original. I'm sure that someone at one time had a really nicely restored 1946 or incorrectly restored, but nicely done 47-48 and "That was it!" From then on, nothing but a dual pattern door was "correct". I'm gonna keep trying though. Now that the perception is so ingrained, it is a tough battle. I have brochures and ads and dealer data books etc. that show the solid pattern, but ridiculous arguments are raised like "For ads and brochures, they often took liberty with the design elements". BUNK!!! Why in the name of god would an artist hired to create artwork for a sales brochure say to him/herself "Hmmm.... I think I'll change the fabric pattern" The only liberties taken, were not really liberties, but necessities. Anyone involved in printwork knows that some colors such as "Cruiser Maroon" and Ivory were extremely difficult to reproduce in the color print process of the period. For that reason, you will see the maroon cars depicted as more of a deep red and ivory as yellow. It simply made for better print. I have a copy of the 46 sales brochure with the pinstriped door panels and a copy of the 47 brochure with the solid panels. It was NOT a matter of printability in that case. It was because the pattern had CHANGED!!!!!! Note the two pics below. The first from a 1947 ad and the second from a Ross Roy comparison brochure (Oh... I'm sure Ross Roy felt it was necessar to doctor the image or that Plymouth supplied them with a specially upholstered demo becuase those two arguments would make a lot more sense than it simply being the way it was LOL!!!!) Please, don't get me wrong. I'm really not angry about this. I'm more amused and a bit determined to get the record straight. I do enjoy being a part of the POC and will continue to be so. Just one little problem I'm having with this particular issue.

Air-Pillow-Ride.jpg

Ross-Roy-comp4.jpg

All well and good for standard P15 Special Deluxes, however, the Taxi versions were probably different. Typically the Interior trim in the Taxi optioned car were leather and or leatherette for long lasting durability. Would like to see a real P15 taxi with it likely more spartan interior dressing. Those pics are interesting for another reason. In the first you can see a Chevy, a Buick and a Studebaker parked in the background behind the "taxi" along with a Jaguar saloon. Parked in the background of the exit scene are three of those 4 cars parked in slightly different order. The Jag apparently didn't make the trasition. Also wonder why the impact to the door on the P15 strongenough to injure poor Jane wasn't even enough to damage the door.

Also any guesses as to what the car was that "hit" the taxi??? I'm going with 52 Ford station wagon.

David, 90% of the P15 I have seen including a few unrestored cars at POC meets here inthe east have unpatterned material onthe door panels. With the same material as on the lower seat frame on the 4 to 6 inches. I think you argument with the POC judging form is 100% meritoreous. But with their resistance to change, I doubt you can get anything done about it regardless of how much visual evidence you present in support of your position. Good luck.

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...the fact that when the passing car "SLAMS" into Jane Wyman's door, knocking her to the street, you see virtually no damage to the door of the P15 and yet it leaves her hospitalized and blind. lol...

I like how the window riser knob is in three different positions between when Jane gets out, Rock gets out and then when everyone is gathered around.

Good pictures and they ought to count toward showing how the cars looked "back when".

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I like how the window riser knob is in three different positions between when Jane gets out, Rock gets out and then when everyone is gathered around.

Good pictures and they ought to count toward showing how the cars looked "back when".

I think those pictures were taken at different times/and or locations. If you look closely, she is getting into the car on the right side, and the window is up. Also note the background in each picture. It's also different. Then she gets out of the car on the left side and in those shots the window is down in those pictures, except for that last picture. In the last picture, it appears the window is now rolled up.

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... to my collection of hundreds of other photos showing original interiors of P15s with the solid color fabric on the door panels. One thing I KNOW from owning several of these and completely restoring my current P15, is that the manner in which the material was crimped to the stainless in order to join the wool with the vinyl at the base, made it impossible to uncrimp and reuse the stainless. This is how you can confirm that the uphostery is in fact original. If they are still crimped, they are the REAL DEAL!!!

David,

When it comes to judging old cars of any kind in an original type club like the POC, they do not know all in their rule books.;) I've said that many times. After all, many of them were not even around when these cars were new. And, if they were they can't remember every detail that is not spelled out in official books, nor was all even in the books to look at. Myself included. I was around back then and rode in those cars. My parents and grandparents always had some sort of Mopar cars from the 40's on up. But..........I was too young to remember all that, nor did I really care at the ripe old age of 4 years old when my coupe was new in 1948. Even the people who are 10 years older than I can't remember all that either, nor did most care then either. All the original clubs say they are committed to "Preserving" the cars of the day. Yet, they did build hot rods and customs in those periods, just like they do today. But.......they were not like the dressed up street rods you see today, they were more like what people call "rat rods" today. So.....if they truly want to "Preserve" automotive history, they should include those rods and customs that are done with period correct accessories, because that is also truly part of automotive history.

Anyway, the next time you get in that discussion about door panels on the 47 - 48 Plymouth, here's a shot of mine. My coupe was all original when I bought it, and the door panel you see is the way it looked when I first bought the car. As you can see, it is just as you described. My coupe was actually built in late 1947 and sold first sold in February 1948 to the original owner. I have the records to that fact. Another interesting point (argument) with the POC when I was a member was the wheels. It originally had 16" wheels until I put 15" wheels on it. Since the car was first sold in 1948, it's officially a 48 car, not 47, because that's the way they were titled back then. Yet, the POC argues, they didn't have 16" wheels on a 48, and refuse to admit it. Yet, my coupe is proof of the fact that you can have 1948 Plymouth with 16" wheels. Or, at least it was until I changed them. With that in mind, they will probably say this door panel isn't original too.:rolleyes: Guess you can't educate people with closed minds though, even when they see it.

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Tod and Norm both pointed out that the window crank and therefore the window are in different positions in several shots which in the movie are less than a second apart lol... I don't believe they changed locations at all. In fact, I'm pretty sure that the location was Lake Arrowhead in California. Someone who lives near the old resort please confirm or not. I have an old postcard from there somewhere. I'll try and dig it out.

I like how the window riser knob is in three different positions between when Jane gets out, Rock gets out and then when everyone is gathered around.

Good pictures and they ought to count toward showing how the cars looked "back when".

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... confirmed that it is in fact The Village Inn at Lake Arrowhead. Here's a copy of the postcard.. and a pic from the film for comparison... You can see the cars parked in the center of the drive as well. It's funny because the pc is from about the same time the movie was filmed.

Lake-Arrowhead-Village-Inn.jpg

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Tod and Norm both pointed out that the window crank and therefore the window are in different positions in several shots which in the movie are less than a second apart lol... I don't believe they changed locations at all. In fact, I'm pretty sure that the location was Lake Arrowhead in California. Someone who lives near the old resort please confirm or not. I have an old postcard from there somewhere. I'll try and dig it out.
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David,

The vinyl and the upper wool were both crimped on the stainless when I removed the material from my door panels. In fact, I believe I still have the stainless in the rafters of the garage. I just ripped the material off the stainless after it was off. I did my interior custom so I didn't need the stainless. However, I did look at it. I believe you could open those crimps and then re-crimp new material onto them. Would be a labor of love to do that though. Would not be a quick job either.

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