Bill from SE WA

When I started working on my 52 dodge, it had a Plymouth 230 in it that was from a passenger car. It had the rear sump oil pan. I didn't give it much thought and when I got my 251, it had a rear sump pan as well. The more I looked at trying to fit everything together, I started seeing the rear sump pan doesn't really work and it's not supposed to be that way on this truck. I finally realized I need a front sump 25 inch oil pan and the correct oil pump pickup. I have looked around and about the only source I can think of is a pilot house Fargo pickup. I don't know what else would be out there that would have this oil pan setup. I need help locating these parts, If anyone has a pan and oil pump pickup for a 25 inch motor or knows where I can get one I would be very grateful. Thanks

No, just planning on welding in a nut plate to screw a bolt into similar to what is there now. I plan on using the 230 front floating power mount.

Sorry forgot to mention I am using the smaller front pulley from the 230 - see earlier posts. It already cleared the front cross member when it was on the 230. When I say I plan on raising the front of the motor I am not talking about much, just enough to slip the belt on or prevent oil pan interference.

I am keeping the fluid drive and it matches the crank everything else bolts up on the bell housing. The radiator may need to be moved forward a little but that won't be too difficult. I will add a couple holes to bolt the motor mount to the front cross member.

I decided I needed to get a few other things in order before getting the motor put in place. I have already determined it will fit with no problems. I am not notching the front cross member for the front pulley. I will just raise it slightly to miss. I have been following the various threads on lowering these trucks and thought this would be a good time to do this as well. However, I wanted to do the axle drop a little differently. They make a new dropped axle for an F1 Ford. This axle is only slightly narrower than the Dodge front axle and you get the benefit of everything being new from hub-to-hub. It's a cross steer setup just like the Dodge and you can purchase dropped steering arms that will clear the spring. The parts are easily available and when it's all said and done, I think it probably costs about the same as some of the other set ups people are doing. The only thing I did was welded the F1 Bolt pattern on the spring perches and drilled new holes to mount the Dodge leaf springs. The Ford frame is straight and the Dodge tapers. Here are a few pictures. I put the axle in ahead of the stock axle. You can see the shock mounts almost line up perfectly. The second picture the spring pads are right where they need to be. The third picture shows the drop. The last picture shows the drilled out spring perches with on of the reversed springs. I have also been collecting a few parts for the motor - Ellis dual intake with Zenith carburetors. I am just about ready to put the axle under the truck.

Just wondering what would be the benefit to switching to a carter B&B over a Zenith 228?

So I have been doing some research and scrounging, and have come up with a couple options for carburetors. I have a Stromberg BXOV in one location and a Zenith in the other location. Both carburetors appear to be the same CFM - at least all the openings are the same. From my research, a pair of Stromberg BXOVs is a sought after combination for a dual carburetor setup. The Zenith is in a more convenient configuration. Today I have one of each, so I need to make the pair. Anyone have an opinion or thoughts in favor of one over the other? Thanks Bill

I purchased an Ellis Dualpower intake manifold for my 251 and was surprised that all my carburetors have a larger bolt pattern than this manifold was designed for. The center-to-center distance between the tapped holes where the carburetor bolts on is 2 5/8. All my Carter and Holley 1 barrel carburetors use a larger bolt pattern. Does anyone know what Carburetor was intended to be used with this manifold?

Hi Everyone, Spent the day in the shop getting the old motor out. Cylinders 3 and 4 were seized in the 230. It was a mess. I was pleasantly surprised to see the bolt pattern on the fluid drive matches the crankshaft on the 251 that I am going to put in. I'm just learning about these engines, and didn't expect they would be the same. Took me a bit to catch up on all the comments here. I did modify the lower crank pulley on the front of the motor from the 230 to fit the 251. It is the same width V-groove just a smaller diameter. The pulley on the 251 had timing marks on the flange so I need to figure out what I am going to do to put timing marks on my smaller pulley. Based on everything I have seen, my plan is to try and just raise the 251 up a bit at the front to miss the front cross member. I think that will work and won't have that much impact I hope. Here are a few pictures. You can see a paper template I made and cut out and slipped on the fluid drive studs to check the bolt pattern. I am crossing my fingers that these will bolt together. I also included a picture of my new motor. It came out of a M37 brush fire truck. In Eastern Oregon and Washington rural fire departments used these trucks to fight brush fires. The truck it came out of was really low mileage and the engine runs well. I've got it up on a stand where I can work on it and get it detailed before it goes in. Trying to decide what I want to do for the intake and exhaust. The factory dodge dual intake/exhaust setup is really cool - I wouldn't mind using one of those if I can find one. I see headers are easily available. Does anyone make an aftermarket dual intake for a 25" motor? I see 23" intakes but that's it. Thanks for all the comments.

Hi Everyone, Thanks for all the great ideas. I thought about notching the cross member. I have seen that done before and I'm not opposed to doing that. Tim's post got me to thinking that if you don't need a dampener, then I could probably run a different smaller diameter pulley. So I took both the 230 and the 251 crank pulley's off. Of course they are different, but I can modify the 230 to fit the 251. Here is a picture of the two. The 251 is the larger of the two. I cleaned up the 230 pulley so I modify it to fit.

So here are a few pictures of my project. I took the nose off because I am working on practically everything on the front of the truck. Right away, I noticed a difference between the 230 D24 engine that's installed and the 251 T154 that I want to put in. The front pulley on the D24 is really close to the front cross member and about 6 1/5 inches in diameter. The front pulley on the T154 is 8 1/2 inches in diameter and there is no way it will clear the front cross member. The other thing I noticed is the D24 is a dampener and the T154 is just a pulley. Wouldn't T154 need a dampener? In order to make this work, can I just put the dampener from the 230 on the 251?

Sorry for all the confusion. The 52 pickup seems to have a 52 Plymouth 230 (based serial number) and it has a fluid drive. This motor is seized and will be removed. Not sure how it's all hooked together because I have not taken it apart yet. The 251 out of the M-37 was obviously a replacement motor, and I am sure replaced a 230 based on the modified front motor mount in the M-37. The one common thing I noticed is that the starter from the 52 pickup works fine on the 251 which makes me believe someone might have left the 230 flywheel in the M-37 when they installed the 251. I know a 2 1/2 ton 251 truck engine never had a fluid drive but was hoping to keep it in the 52 pickup and wondering if anyone had any experience making a combination like this work. I hope this explains what I am trying to do a little better. Seems like it should work based on everything I see, just wondering if I am missing anything. Thanks

I am working on a 251 to replace the stuck 230 in my 52 dodge pickup. The engine I found is a rebuilt 251 that was in an M-37. I know this is a 25 inch motor instead of the smaller 23 currently installed in the 52. When I got the 251, it didn't come with a starter so I put the 230 starter on it. This is before I realized the 251 could have a different flywheel tooth count. Anyway putting the 230 starter on was no problem and it worked fine - didn't bind up and sounded ok. So is this normal? The M37 that I got this motor out of was an ex brush fire truck from central Oregon. The front mount was welded to the frame instead of bolted. I am betting the M had a 230 originally and it was replaced with the 251 at a later date. The serial number on the block is from a 48 to 49 truck. So I now have a few questions. First - could the 230 flywheel fit on this motor (explaining why the starter didn't get bound up)? The 52 has a three speed fluid drive. Will I be able to bolt the fluid drive to the 251? I'm pretty excited about getting this motor installed it the 52. I fired it off briefly and it sounds really strong. Can't wait to get it cleaned up and ready to go. I have it on a run in stand so it will be easy to work on and get running before being installed. Any help you can provide would be great. Thanks for letting come here and ask questions. The 52 is going to be treated a dropped front axle, new brakes, and a higher geared rear axle. I have not decided what I want to do with the body. For now I just want to get it on the road with a good reliable engine and updated suspension.