paint booth up and running.

[Los_Control]

Squirting some paint, working ok for the parts I am spraying , splash pans, mud guards core support etc...

For these items, pretty easy to get to bare metal, some areas not so easy.

Then I use the sand blaster to get to areas I cant get mechanically.

Then I spray with a rust converter "ospho" Prime and paint. Not perfect, but better condition then when I got it.

 

something I am concerned about, I will have to play with it and see what kind of finish I can get.

For splash pans and frame, I love it. For body panels, doors, hood etc ... not so sure if I love it.

Seems like a bit of texture, I am guessing is the paint, not sure if can buff it out smooth then wax, is cheap enamel paint.

I want cheap paint, maybe my expectations are to high. I really do want to stick with a single stage paint though, maybe I can play with air pressure and such.

 

[Los_Control]

And the paint booth

 

 

[ggdad1951]

I assume you painted the rad support an the surround individually and put them together for the pic?

[Plymouthy Adams]

58 minutes ago, Los_Control said:

And the paint booth

 

 

 

I was looking to see a filtered equipped door, big exhaust fan and abundance of lights and a wet floor system in place.    If it is wet out you pretty much get that, natural light, rain settles the dust from the ground and in the air and hopefully just enough breeze (at your back) to clear the fog....

[Los_Control]

10 minutes ago, ggdad1951 said:

I assume you painted the rad support an the surround individually and put them together for the pic?

Did I ever thank you properly for sending me the broken switch? It was exactly what I needed to fix mine. I really appreciate it.

In this project, the paint is just long overdue neglected maintenance. I am not restoring.

 

I did not separate surround and core support.

Everything is actually cleaning up pretty good. In this project.

And so far, I am pretty much breaking every bolt as I remove them, to be expected.

That piece, was really bolted in well, it had some paint on it, it cleaned up well ... I just primed it as is.

Because the nuts are welded to the core support, if I actually broke one and the bolts are a fine thread ... I might actually open a can of worms I do not want to deal with.

And it is fine the way it is.

 

Problem is, as is it is to heavy for my paint booth. I may end up taking it apart yet for paint.

 

[Los_Control]

6 minutes ago, Plymouthy Adams said:

 

I was looking to see a filtered equipped door, big exhaust fan and abundance of lights and a wet floor system in place.    If it is wet out you pretty much get that, natural light, rain settles the dust from the ground and in the air and hopefully just enough breeze (at your back) to clear the fog....

I did wet the ground before spraying  

 

PA, does that spray texture look normal for enamel?

I am just not sure if that is what I should expect, then buff and wax to improve the finish?

Just a work truck, I will be hauling tools and lumber with it ... it will work.

 

When I connected the hplv gun, I could not adjust the regulator on it, I cleaned it properly a few months ago.

So was going to pull the regulator and just set the reg on my compressor. Found some bug had moved into the air line and made a cocoon.

So I cleaned the gun again

I thought my spray pattern was good, my airflow set right ... just the texture of the paint I did not like.

I dunno, If I want a old truck, that may be just the look I want

Just wondering if anyone that sprayed enamel, thinks it should look like that.

[DJ194950]

Los_,

Try thinning you paint a bit and also try raising your air pressure a little at a time with trial spray outs on some newspaper, a old box, etc. to refine your setup. I believe it will help get a smoother coat.

It is best with enamels to spray a medium coat and let that get tacky then 1-2 wet coats for coverage and smoothness, the tack coat helps a lot with preventing runs!

 

Good to see that your truck with your work will last through generations to come!

 

DJ

[Plymouthy Adams]

with HVLP...viscosity is you main factor followed by fan and flow.....to stay within the limits of the gun and federal mandates...you cannot bust 10PSI tip...a true HVLP will have the max input at the gun listed...this input verifies that the output pressure is within specs...maybe at home you can get away with raising  your input pressure but you just totally defeated the very purpose and function of the HVLP.....bust this in an industrial environment...EPA gonna bust you very hard...no blinking of the eye...

[Los_Control]

8 minutes ago, DJ194950 said:

Good to see that your truck with your work will last through generations to come!

Thanks DJ,

That is my only goal, preserve it and drive the wheels off of it ... when I am gone, next guy can do what he wants. Wont effect me any.

I think you may agree with me, The paint looks like a cats butt.

 

What I did, I mixed the paint really well, then because it is hot triple digits I used lacquer thinner to thin it

I dumped some paint in a coffee can and then dumped some thinner in. I was Leary about adding too much.

Possible I just did not add enough thinner, and will smooth out with more.

I just need more practice, but I think my first attempt is not body panel ready.

[Los_Control]

8 minutes ago, Plymouthy Adams said:

with HVLP...viscosity is

 .... ouch!   will you come bail me out of jail PA!  

[Plymouthy Adams]

number one, you should not be using lacquer thinner on an enamel paint...given I read what you wrote above correctly.....

 

[jeffsunzeri]

What you have is orange peel. It is not expected for a good enamel finish, but very common for less experienced painters.

Some tips:

- with enamel, start with 50% of the mixture being enamel reducer.

- If you're real particular, check your thinned/reduced mixture with a Zahn cup against the paint manufacturer's recommendations. With some experience, you'll be able to judge the right thinness by dipping your stir stick in the mixture and timing the change from stream to drip when you remove it from the paint cup. I like about 3-4 seconds.

- In humid areas, don't wet the paint floor. The extra humidity is a bad thing. Much worse than the specs of dust. Also, your feet will flip up mud spots from the muddy floor. Not good. Also, a wet floor is a slippery floor. Also, not good.

- A great helper to the home-based painter is accelerator/hardener. Read the instructions, and make sure you have good breathing equipment. The accelerator helps tremendously to get rid of a number of problems like fish-eyes, and it also adds significant gloss.

[DJ194950]

I was told a while back when at a auto body/paint supply store-

 

You thin lacquers with thinner.

 

You reduce enamels with reducer.

 

Anyone else heard that??

 

Lacquer thinner is almost always too fast drying to be used in enamels. Some painters used to add lacquer thinner to enamels to get a flat finish!

 

DJ

[Los_Control]

29 minutes ago, Plymouthy Adams said:

number one, you should not be using lacquer thinner on an enamel paint...given I read what you wrote above correctly.....

 

You read it right .... I have 2 gallons around to clean stuff.

I read Acetone is good, but in hot weather it dries too quick, Paint thinner dries slower and better in hot weather. So I used the lacquer thinner.

The internet says to use paint thinner in hot weather for a slower dry time.

Is there a difference between lacquer thinner and paint thinner?

You see where I am going here, I did not know. I thought Lacquer thinner was just high class paint thinner.

Maybe this is the issue I need to correct.

Will adjust this for the next spray.

 

I see DJ also jumped in and confirms this.

I thank you DJ, and will fix this problem.

[Plymouthy Adams]

Use a quality thinner if shooting top coat lacquer and the cheap stuff for cleanup.  If shooting enamel paint, use a good high grade reducer, stay away from standard solvents like mineral spirits etc.  You need a good reducer for the ambient temp you are shooting as not only is reducing important, so is controlling the flash times.  

You should also look into use of fisheye eliminator and invest in a good catalyst for you paint.   This stuff IS NOT expensive.....but then each jobber is pricing based on competition.....little or no competition....prices soar....

[Los_Control]

7 minutes ago, Plymouthy Adams said:

Use a quality thinner if shooting top coat lacquer and the cheap stuff for cleanup.  If shooting enamel paint, use a good high grade reducer, stay away from standard solvents like mineral spirits etc.  You need a good reducer for the ambient temp you are shooting as not only is reducing important, so is controlling the flash times.  

You should also look into use of fisheye eliminator and invest in a good catalyst for you paint.   This stuff IS NOT expensive.....but then each jobber is pricing based on competition.....little or no competition....prices soar....

I think I may need to go to napa and get a package.

What I am doing is fine for the frame and rock guard panels , but body I want a little better quality for the body panels.

 

I give it some thought, just possible a 18 year old kid at napa has no idea for the paint job am looking for.

I really do need to switch to a reducer, and play some more .... What I have done, I am fine with it ... I just want to improve as I go.

 

[DJ194950]

This is a good time to learn how to paint a nice job.

Mistakes now are fine but if you improve your finishes, you will be good to go on the later stuff that you may want to look good.

Jus' sayin'.

 

DJ

[kencombs]

3 hours ago, Los_Control said:

I did wet the ground before spraying  

 

PA, does that spray texture look normal for enamel?

I am just not sure if that is what I should expect, then buff and wax to improve the finish?

 

Just wondering if anyone that sprayed enamel, thinks it should look like that.

Enamels don't get hard enough soon enough to color sand and buff.  You should practice until the paint looks like you want it to look as soon as it's sprayed.  Varies by brand, but common equipment enamels generally spray well at 10-25% reduction.  If using an automotive grade, I follow the label + a bit to get it to flow nicely.  Over-reduduction will lower the gloss when it dries, but you can mitigate that by using hardener, if you have adequate breathing protection.

 

I normally spray with the fluid adjustment wide open, unless painting smaller parts.  With most guns, around 30-35psi input will get me the fan and atomization needed.  I always use a gun mounted regulator so I can adjust on the fly if needed. 

 

Most important thing is to watch fan where it hits the metal and keep a wet glossy looking edge, after the first tack coat.  That will get you the gloss needed.

 

The type of reducer should match the paint maker's recommendation.  That is especially true when you move to the body panels.

 

Edit to add:  I have several cheap guns for underbody, tractors, fender wells etc.  I use a Devilbiss GTI for outer panels.  there are lots of ways to get a good finish but it is hard to beat a lower end urethane single stage for our old stuff.  It looks like an older enamel but is much more durable a easier to repair mistakes or later damage.  Hardens quickly, color sands well and buffs out.  More expensive sure, but worth every penny IMO.  This will give you an idea of price and type I'm referring to:

https://www.ebay.com/itm/Fleet-White-Gallon-Kit-Single-Stage-ACRYLIC-URETHANE-Auto-Paint-Kit/331367156151?hash=item4d270589b7:g:LgsAAOSw~1FUWQ8i

Edited August 22, 2019 by kencombs

[Dave72dt]

Something I'd suggest is printing off the tech sheets for the product you're spraying.  It's going to include recommended spray pressures, nozzle size, reduction percentages, recommended reducer, flash times, surface prep, recoat times, cure times, spray pattern, number of coats and how to apply.  Common equipment enamels usually don't have much UV protection built into them and cure slowly so adding a gloss hardener helps reduce cure time and color fade.  Be aware also that reducers are designed to evap off  at a specific rate flow within a specific temp range.  That evap rate plays a role in how well the paint levels out after spraying and in how well it stays where it's placed.

 

A solvent that evaps quickly may not give the paint enough time to self level resulting in a heavier orange peel.  There are other things that can factor into it as well such as air pressure, air volume, how thick the paint is.  From what I saw in the pic, I think you've got a combination of factors, all four of the ones I've mentioned. I tape a sheet of mask on the wall to check my pattern, make adjustments to the gun and/or material and recheck the pattern until it's right before aiming the gun at the project.

 

 

[Los_Control]

7 hours ago, Dave72dt said:

Something I'd suggest is printing off the tech sheets for the product you're spraying. 

Thanks to everyone for the great advice.

Reading Daves post this morning, I thought was good advice and search online for the instructions to exact product I have. "Ace rust stop enamel"

I should use mineral spirits with it, which is a more refined version of paint thinner. Either one would work.

Lacquer thinner does not mix with oil based paints!

 

Then I found some reviews online, and a thread on H.A.M.B about this paint.

Seems that most think the paint is crap. Guy spraying it is having problems, other replies from those that have used it, would never use it again and even recommend he sands off the first gallon and start over.

Reading the data on the paint, says you can not spray it on bare metal. I am expecting to do this on some areas .... one of the advantages to a enamel paint.

It is only $30 a gallon at Ace, cheap lesson.

 

Think I will drive to town and buy a different brand. Rustoleum seems to be the standard for enamel paint.

Tractor supply I think sells valspar? Valspar also makes a hardener that can use with rustoleum.

I just do not know what brand of paint will end up with, I am limited to 3 stores.

Tractor supply

West Texas home and garden  (small home depot)

Napa

 

Does anyone have a opinion on tractor supply paint?

 

 

[Plymouthy Adams]

Tractor supply is no longer Valspar...it is another brand...it is an enamel, the lower cost enamels often are a high solids alkyd based.  Valspar was a very good product....the latest stuff the jury is out but a test is ongoing.    This is more in line to the paint these cars originally came with...high solids.  These paint are very quick covering, forgiving to shoot, but do like to oxidize a bit in direct constant sunlight but being they do come with a compatible catalyst holdout is greatly improved.  They are compatible with good high grade reducers and most all enamel enhancers like fish eye eliminator.  Garage parked cars with good wax coat should do well.  One draw back to the catalyst they use is it has a timed wait prior to shooting.  As with any paint that is not in a spray can off the shelf.  Your mixing, reducing and means of application method and technique all come into play.  No guarantee will cover external human intervention.   And in answer to the comment that no enamel will allow quick sand and buff....sorry but one does and can be color sanded and buffed in 16 hours.  Plenty of paint lines to chose from, plenty of price ranges...pick one that you can live with and let the big dog bark...

[Los_Control]

9 minutes ago, Plymouthy Adams said:

Plenty of paint lines to chose from, plenty of price ranges...pick one that you can live with and let the big dog bark...

I think I will probably be ok with tractor supply paint. I will go there first and see what they have available ... do they have reducer and fish eye?

 

Then drive to the home and garden place, pickup some more sandpaper, see what they have available for paint.

 

Then will stop by napa, will probably be buying the reducer and fish eye from there, some tack cloth. See what they have for a single stage paint.

I just may end up buying everything together at napa, at least wont have to worry about mixing and matching products.

 

I just have a mental issue about napa, When I lived in WA, the local napa had ridiculous pricing.

A tire chuck to air up tires, was marked at $25 or something stupid like that. When you go to pay for it,

We like you, you can have 20% off today ... why not just mark it at a reasonable price in the first place.

So now I am gun shy about going to napa. So far here in TX, they have been pretty reasonable the few times I have stopped there.

 

A year ago, I really wanted to do a real lacquer paint. Shopping online for the paint, the price cured me of that thought.

 

[Plymouthy Adams]

Napa is independently owned...yes they have multiple tier pricing....one day they kiss ya..the next they hit you in the head...past few times in there I have been treated kindly, the one counter person realized one day I lived just a couple miles south of his place.  

 

Napa was and I think still are a jobber for Martin Seymour paint....good stuff....finding a store with a paint mixing department may be a killer.  I have shot some of that what was 35 years old and it was as if new.   Sherwin Williams has an automotive line...but finding them may be tough.  Rogers was a good name that was carried by some independent jobbers.  At one time only source for a very true British Racing Green.    As far as PSA disc or other types of sanding paper etc....do you have a HF near you?   Personally I am a BASF fan...their Limco line is awesome and affordable.  

[kencombs]

1 minute ago, Plymouthy Adams said:

Napa is independently owned...yes they have multiple tier pricing....one day they kiss ya..the next they hit you in the head...past few times in there I have been treated kindly, the one counter person realized one day I lived just a couple miles south of his place.  

 

Napa was and I think still are a jobber for Martin Seymour paint....good stuff....finding a store with a paint mixing department may be a killer.  I have shot some of that what was 35 years old and it was as if new.   Sherwin Williams has an automotive line...but finding them may be tough.  Rogers was a good name that was carried by some independent jobbers.  At one time only source for a very true British Racing Green.    As far as PSA disc or other types of sanding paper etc....do you have a HF near you?   Personally I am a BASF fan...their Limco line is awesome and affordable.  

Martin Senour paint from NAPA is good stuff.   Relabeled Sherwin Williams.  Lots of good paints out there that cost less though.  I order most all of mine online because the local NAPA, Oriellys, and autobody store just can't come close to the online pricing.  That's for cars/trucks, tractors and equipment get farm store enamel, sometimes with hardener.

Reducers and lacquer thinners are bought locally.

 

PA, you mentions 'one' enamel that hardens quickly for color sanding and buffing, can you share the brand name?

[Los_Control]

4 minutes ago, Plymouthy Adams said:

finding a store with a paint mixing department may be a killer

This store does have paint mixing capabilities. I talked to them once about mixing up some touch up paint for my chevy. They can mix a quart or more, or put it in a aerosol can for me.

 

Harbor freight or any other large store, home depot, a paint store like sherwin williams is a 3 hour drive round trip. That does not include driving around Abilene searching addresses.

 

Just going to napa today is a 1.5 hour round trip. As Ken says, I may order it online in the end.

But now the wife needs to go and she needs things, then walmart is going to be involved .... going to town ends up being a day trip 

Off I go...