53.stock Plymouth speed

[pflaming]

Per my high school recollection the '53 Plymouth was a very fast car. Should have my '53 stock Suburban drivable in a few weeks, so will find out.  I'm getting anxious. Anyone have a fast '53 or '54 stock Plymouth? 

[knuckleharley]

"Fast" is a relative term. Stock 53 Plymouths were faster than stock 53 chebbies or Fords,but even the 4 cylinder economy cars of today will beat one like a rented mule.

[55 Fargo]

1 hour ago, pflaming said:

Per my high school recollection the '53 Plymouth was a very fast car. Should have my '53 stock Suburban drivable in a few weeks, so will find out.  I'm getting anxious. Anyone have a fast '53 or '54 stock Plymouth? 

Interesting hypothesis, 1953 Plymouth, 218,98 hp 3 spd standard, overdrive optional, 3.73, 3.90 or 4.11 rearend.

I suppose this car could be real peppy with lower rear gears, and have some nice top end with the overdrive.

I would say 85 mph top speed.  can you post your top speed once you get it on the road?

[55 Fargo]

15 minutes ago, knuckleharley said:

"Fast" is a relative term. Stock 53 Plymouths were faster than stock 53 chebbies or Fords,but even the 4 cylinder economy cars of today will beat one like a rented mule.

Well no kidding, my elcheapo 1997 Neon Sport would blow the blankin doors of these cars. My 1989 Firefly would have too.

I had a 1960 Chevy though once, 235 and powerglide, very very slow...

[pflaming]

Dad had a 56 Ford, I always drove it at 80 mph. Forget the modern comps, not aples for apples. I recall that my friend's '53 Plymouth was a 90 mph car and got up there very quickly. I drive comfortably at 65 mph with my 218 - 3:73 rear ratio truck.  Since my Suburban will have the same, it should cruise at 70 mph.  Will know more in a few. 

[knuckleharley]

2 minutes ago, pflaming said:

Dad had a 56 Ford, I always drove it at 80 mph. Forget the modern comps, not aples for apples. I recall that my friend's '53 Plymouth was a 90 mph car and got up there very quickly. I drive comfortably at 65 mph with my 218 - 3:73 rear ratio truck.  Since my Suburban will have the same, it should cruise at 70 mph.  Will know more in a few. 

Some,maybe even most 56 Fords had Y-Block V-8's. They were considerably faster than any 6 cylinder car of the era. So where the V-8 chebbies and Plymouths,neither of which could run with the Y-Block. To go fast with a Mopar in 56 you had to get a D-500 Dodge or go higher up the food chain to DeSoto or Chrysler.

[MackTheFinger]

51 minutes ago, knuckleharley said:

Some,maybe even most 56 Fords had Y-Block V-8's. They were considerably faster than any 6 cylinder car of the era. So where the V-8 chebbies and Plymouths,neither of which could run with the Y-Block. To go fast with a Mopar in 56 you had to get a D-500 Dodge or go higher up the food chain to DeSoto or Chrysler.

I'd think 85-90 mph would be about topped out for most of the stock 23" flathead sixes.. They're good, durable motors, though; and it probably wouldn't hurt to run them at that speed for short periods occasionally but 60-65 is my comfort zone with the odd burst to 70+. I'm not in a hurry to get anywhere.

About 1970-71 there was a guy that ran a stock 272 y-block '57 Ford at the local dragstrip. He got so much of a head start on everyone that it was impossible to catch him in the 1/8th mile. He regularly beat big-block Chevy's, Mopars, and Pontiacs. Of course he was about 3 lengths from the finish line before they left.. I remember one guy running an almost untouchable 426 Wedge that came up against him once and lost.. The Y-block was an okay motor but if you recall it wasn't all that durable. Not enough main bearings and poor overhead oiling..

Edited April 28, 2017 by MackTheFinger
speling

[Plymouthy Adams]

my all stock 54 runs 85 with no effort and it is 230 and powerflite tranny with 3.73 axle.  While there is plenty of pedal left topush down, the front end on these cars with the original stock shocks makes it float like a boat at that speed, not really a comfortable reassuring track and of course I am still running bias WWW's albeit they are  new tires may also add to the mix.  75 is comfortable however and is accomplished with little effort. 

[Bobacuda]

My 51 Plymouth would run 70-85 all day.  Above 75, I would always start thinking about the front end parts that could break and what the consequences at that speed would be.  When I was young and dumb, I did get it up to 100 a couple of times and that was all there was and there wasn't any more.  If there was, I wasn't interested.

[Dodgeb4ya]

My 53 Savoy wagon drove like a boat. It was tight and aligned. 80 was scary!

I like the way the earlier cars handled.

1953 and 54 MoPars had the rear springs splayed at an angle and just seemed to not handle as well as earlier or later cars IMO.

Keep it under 70 Paul.

[pflaming]

Wednesday on my 180 mile run, my truck with the electric rad fan ran hotter than I like so I drove by the temp gauge which was around 55 mph. I usually drive it at 65+\- and it did not like 55 mph.  I believe these engines ran where the driver pushed them to, smoothed out there  and let the good times roll. JMHO 

[55 Fargo]

19 minutes ago, pflaming said:

Wednesday on my 180 mile run, my truck with the electric rad fan ran hotter than I like so I drove by the temp gauge which was around 55 mph. I usually drive it at 65+\- and it did not like 55 mph.  I believe these engines ran where the driver pushed them to, smoothed out there  and let the good times roll. JMHO 

Okay notwithstanding the road surface, terrain and wind.

You have what for rear gears and tire size?

How is it that the truck likes a little higher speed/ RPM, is it lugging at 55 mph?

if you are say 2200 RPM at 55 mph, and 2800 at 65 mph, how would the engine like it better?

Most go for an overdrive for 2000 rpm or so at 65 mph.

I 

[knuckleharley]

1 hour ago, MackTheFinger said:

I'd think 85-90 mph would be about topped out for most of the stock 23" flathead sixes.. They're good, durable motors, though; and it probably wouldn't hurt to run them at that speed for short periods occasionally but 60-65 is my comfort zone with the odd burst to 70+. I'm not in a hurry to get anywhere.

About 1970-71 there was a guy that ran a stock 272 y-block '57 Ford at the local dragstrip. He got so much of a head start on everyone that it was impossible to catch him in the 1/8th mile. He regularly beat big-block Chevy's, Mopars, and Pontiacs. Of course he was about 3 lengths from the finish line before they left.. I remember one guy running an almost untouchable 426 Wedge that came up against him once and lost.. The Y-block was an okay motor but if you recall it wasn't all that durable. Not enough main bearings and poor overhead oiling..

The 239 and 272's were dogs,but once Ford got serious about making power,the 292's and especially the 312's were beating everything else like rented mules. I had a friend with a dead stock 57 Ford Custom 300 2dr ht with the E-Bird optional 312 and Fordomatic in it from the factory,and I was in it one night with 5 other people as we just ran away and left a dual-quad 58 Corvette,and that guy was by himself. He also regularly outran another friend that had a J-2 57 Olds.  It was a (hard) used car when he bought it,and as a 19 year old sailor interested in drag racing you know he dogged it to death,but the only work I know of he ever had to do to it was a valve job.

[Plymouthy Adams]

6 minutes ago, knuckleharley said:

The 239 and 272's were dogs,but once Ford got serious about making power,the 292's and especially the 312's were beating everything else like rented mules. I had a friend with a dead stock 57 Ford Custom 300 2dr ht with the E-Bird optional 312 and Fordomatic in it from the factory,and I was in it one night with 5 other people as we just ran away and left a dual-quad 58 Corvette,and that guy was by himself. He also regularly outran another friend that had a J-2 57 Olds.  It was a (hard) used car when he bought it,and as a 19 year old sailor interested in drag racing you know he dogged it to death,but the only work I know of he ever had to do to it was a valve job.

next rime try racing these guys while both cars are going in the same direction...  one should not pick on the elderly eaten up with arthritis either..ok..had my jab for the day...

[pflaming]

1 hour ago, Plymouthy Adams said:

  one should not pick on the elderly eaten up with arthritis either..ok..had my jab for the day...

Adams, now you are getting personal! Where ias the monitor when we need him? LOL

[RobertKB]

My stock/original/survivor '53 Plymouth with 100,000+ miles doesn't like anything over 55 MPH. Engine had rings, a burnt valve replaced, and the other valves lapped at 72,000 miles but is still using the original bearing shells. It idles like it is brand new but with that many miles on the engine, I don't push it. I have owned the car since 1975 and it is extremely reliable.

Paint is original as well but has the gravel rash to prove it.

Edited April 28, 2017 by RobertKB

[knuckleharley]

I hope that one day I will be lucky enough to buy a old car with original paint that nice.

Yeah,you can repaint them and make them look nice,but a car is only original once.

[knuckleharley]

3 hours ago, MackTheFinger said:

I'd think 85-90 mph would be about topped out for most of the stock 23" flathead sixes.. They're good, durable motors, though; and it probably wouldn't hurt to run them at that speed for short periods occasionally but 60-65 is my comfort zone with the odd burst to 70+. I'm not in a hurry to get anywhere.

About 1970-71 there was a guy that ran a stock 272 y-block '57 Ford at the local dragstrip. He got so much of a head start on everyone that it was impossible to catch him in the 1/8th mile. He regularly beat big-block Chevy's, Mopars, and Pontiacs. Of course he was about 3 lengths from the finish line before they left.. I remember one guy running an almost untouchable 426 Wedge that came up against him once and lost.. The Y-block was an okay motor but if you recall it wasn't all that durable. Not enough main bearings and poor overhead oiling..

BTW,I bought a 428 Cobra Jet Torino when I came back from VN,and took it out to Cumberland Int Dragway in Fayetteville to drag race it. Or at least I thought that was what I was going to do. Then the local Pontiac dealer showed up with a radio and heater delete Ram Air 4 GTO on the dealership ramp truck,the Chebby dealer showed up with a factory Chevelle race car,and the Mopar dealer showed up with his Roadrunner.

I didn't even bother to run. There is no way you can compete in the stock classes with a daily driver when running against dealer-prepped dedicated drag cars. There were two brothers from Clinton,NC that showed up driving NHRA record holding Novas. One was a 305 and the other was a 350. Supposed to be dead stock,and were running cast iron intakes and factory carbs,skinny tires,the whole bit. One was J stock and the other was L stock. I have seen the L stock run a full second under the J stock NHRA national record when he wanted to. They had a teen age nephew running a 57 Chebby 2dr sedan that was all steel and had a small block in it,and he was picking both front wheels off the ground when he shifted to second gear. Of course,that one wasn't even pretending to be stock.

I eventually got tired of paying more for insurance each month than I was paying for car payment,and traded it in on  a 4 cylinder Toyotta Corolla with a automatic trans.

Took the Toyotta to the strip and ran bracket 5 in it,and was dialed it at somewhere around 19 seconds. I never failed to make car payment money each month,leaving the line with the car in drive,and just driving to the finish line. The one guy that was my biggest threat drove a stone stock 53 Ford pu with the flat V-8 and Fordomatic trans. Tire spin wasn't a major consideration for either of us.

What was funny was running against the A Stock,which is what they were laughingly called, I'd leave the line several seconds before they were allowed to pull away,and I'd be watching my rear view window for the cloud of tire smoke I knew I would be seeing,and they would blow by me in the traps so fast it would scare me. Usually running too fast and breaking out of bracket.

[RobertKB]

6 minutes ago, knuckleharley said:

I hope that one day I will be lucky enough to buy a old car with original paint that nice.

Yeah,you can repaint them and make them look nice,but a car is only original once.

Thanks for the compliment. I agree they are only original once and that is why the car has bumpers that could be rechromed, trim replaced in a couple of places, and a front seat that's a bit worn. I love the fact it is original whereas other cars I have, have had a lot work done to them. I basically just do maintenance to it and I enjoy it as much as when I bought it 42 years ago. It has always lived inside since I have owned it.

[Mike36]

 Many years ago I had a 57 Ford Custom 300, powered by a 292 with 4 bbl and dual exhaust, 3 speed overdrive. It ran pretty good for the day, but I can't imagine a 272 shutting down a 426 wedge. That Ford either had a 4.88 or lower gears , or engine mods, or both. Not gonna happen if the Ford was stock. I rode in several of both, and those 426's were very quick.

[moose]

My '54 Belvedere will do 100, 3.73 gears.  My overdrive hasn't worked for years, maybe get it fixed one day and see what it'll do then.

[55 Fargo]

2 hours ago, moose said:

My '54 Belvedere will do 100, 3.73 gears.  My overdrive hasn't worked for years, maybe get it fixed one day and see what it'll do then.

Well holy smokes moose, what about the Hotrod?

I cannot imagine doing a 100 in my truck, 80 is crazy enough...

[knuckleharley]

4 hours ago, Mike36 said:

 Many years ago I had a 57 Ford Custom 300, powered by a 292 with 4 bbl and dual exhaust, 3 speed overdrive. It ran pretty good for the day, but I can't imagine a 272 shutting down a 426 wedge. That Ford either had a 4.88 or lower gears , or engine mods, or both. Not gonna happen if the Ford was stock. I rode in several of both, and those 426's were very quick1 i

Where did I ever make that claim? I clearly stated engines of the same era,1 in a 57 Olds and 1 in a 58 Corvette. Ford didn't even have a big block until 1958,when the FE came out.

Neither did anyone else,come to think of it. Some,like Caddillac's and Lincoln's did have a big block,but they didn't offer a small block,and it was a luxury car engine,not a hot rod engine.

Edited April 29, 2017 by knuckleharley

[knuckleharley]

2 hours ago, moose said:

My '54 Belvedere will do 100, 3.73 gears.  My overdrive hasn't worked for years, maybe get it fixed one day and see what it'll do then.

Do you think it makes enough power to pull more speed in overdrive?

100 mph is a pretty respectable speed for the time.

[Mike36]

10 hours ago, knuckleharley said:

Where did I ever make that claim? I clearly stated engines of the same era,1 in a 57 Olds and 1 in a 58 Corvette. Ford didn't even have a big block until 1958,when the FE came out.

Neither did anyone else,come to think of it. Some,like Caddillac's and Lincoln's did have a big block,but they didn't offer a small block,and it was a luxury car engine,not a hot rod engine.

Knuckleharley, I wasn't referring to what you had written. Sorry I should have been more clear. I was referring to post no7. I clearly remember how a 426 Mopar would slam me back in the seat at full throttle, and NO stock 272 Ford could come close to that. But I do have a question, are the Hemi engines of the 50's not considered big blocks? I know the first ones were 331 ci, but I always considered them big blocks. I enjoy your posts, keep on typing.