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Don Coatney

I have quickly became a Stromberg fan

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For the past fifteen or so years running Carter B&B carburetors on my P-15 and having to pump the foot feed several times and choke to the max for a cold engine start after only a few days I thought that was the normal requirement to get these flathead engines started. My Stromberg equipped D-24 has been sitting in my sort of heated garage un-started for close to 4 months. Today due to an unfortunate act of nature I had to move the car outside to make room in my garage for my wife's car window replacement. After about 3 short starter bursts and only a couple of foot feed pumps the engine came to life. I am impressed. Six volt system with a strong battery and a Pertronix ignition module. I believe this happened because the Stromberg carburetor is tightly sealed and does not allow gasoline to evaporate such as the B&B's do.

001.JPG

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Don,  To prove the fact that the Stromberg is a tighter fit than the carter then you would have to let the same car sit for the same amount of time and then prior to trying to start the car then take the air horn off the carb and then see if there is any fuel in the bowel and the rest of the carb. You stated that you had to pump the pedal a few times so not sure if this proves that the Stromberg is better than the Carter.  Also would have to test the carter is the same fashion to make a true comparison as to which has the tighter fir and the less evaporation of gas.

 

Rich Hartung

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Might just be the difference the Pertronix module makes too. ;) If you stop and think about it this system isn't really subject to problems caused by dirt, moisture or corrosion like a set of points and a condenser. And it is a 1000 times less likely to have an adjustment problem.

Jeff

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4 hours ago, Don Coatney said:

Rich, What carburetor is on your car?

Don, I have a Ball and Ball cater carb and the original carb for the car.  Yes when it sits I have to use my electric pump to pump gas up the line.  But If I startit every day like I would have been like an owner back in 1939 there is no issue. I think some of the issue might be that the newer gas ye might evaporate and also since the fuel line and fuel pump is so low on the front of the engine the fuel might just run back down to the pump.  This is only a quesstimation on my part.

 

So if thje Stromberg carbs are so much better then why did Chrysler only put them on the Dodge and not the higher priced chrylsers and Desoto's and only put them on the next to last car division based on price?

Rich Hartung 

Edited by desoto1939

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30 minutes ago, desoto1939 said:

So if thje Stromberg carbs are so much better then why did Chrysler only put them on the Dodge and not the higher priced chrylsers and Desoto's and only put them on the next to last car division based on price?

Rich, those answers are probably lost to history. Maybe Chrysler Corp wanted to trial the Stromberg unit, or maybe they wanted an alternative if one or the other supplier failed to deliver for any reason. 

Rick

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2 hours ago, desoto1939 said:

 

 Yes when it sits I have to use my electric pump to pump gas up the line. 

Rich Hartung 

Rich, that is my point. I did not use a secondary pump or other means to prime the Carburetor. When I shut the engine down several months ago the gas did not evaporate same as it did in the B&B carburetors.

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Wouldn't the damper hole in the  bowl cause more  evaporation?

And speaking of Stromberg, I just replaced the Carter in my Dodge with a Stromberg because of the damper because I have fluid drive. Does anyone know where to get those little copper orings to seal those two plugs in the bottom of the  fuel bowl?

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55 minutes ago, meadowbrook said:

Wouldn't the damper hole in the  bowl cause more  evaporation?

And speaking of Stromberg, I just replaced the Carter in my Dodge with a Stromberg because of the damper because I have fluid drive. Does anyone know where to get those little copper orings to seal those two plugs in the bottom of the  fuel bowl?

Any well stocked auto parts house should have an assortment of various sized copper washers, if that's what your after. Not aware of copper o rings.

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My friends back in highschool that had 47 plymouths used Strombergs because they made the car faster.. FWIW

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I have been pleasantly surprised at how easy my car is to start even after sitting all winter. I think it has to do with several things. The fuel pump has a glass bowl that holds a fair amount of gas - that does not evaporate on sitting. So it has almost instantaneous fuel after a short crank. I cheat this a little by dumping a small amount of gas down the carb when starting after sitting all winter. I have not tried starting it without that in the spring. It has the B&B carter one barrel.

During the summer the car will sit for a week or two - sometimes longer (while I am working on it), and even then - just a quick stomp on the gas pedal and twist of the key and she is up running like a top, no extra gas dumped in.

Fuel evaporation is the big problem for carbureted engines. We all know the evaporation rate is faster in warm weather, but do not forget that winter blend gas has butane in it making it flash off even more quickly once cold weather is over. 

The other factor which i have found to be very true is the  ignition systems health. I am using points and stock stuff except the plugs - I use NGKs. I tested a bunch of plugs for primary resistance and NGKs are the most consistent. Almost all right at 5 KOhms. No other brands i tested were better. This includes champions (the worst), AC delco, Autolite. Plugs and ignition energy have a huge part to play in starting. When I re-wired my car I used a late model ford starter solenoid. On these there are two leads for the ignition - one for 12 v and the other for stepped down voltage of around 8 volts. The full 12 volts is supplied during cranking, and switches to 8 volts after its running, I have to believe that helps alot.

Strombergs may be slower in evaporation. Easy way to tell, is to remove the air cleaner after it sits a long time - move the throttle linkage without starting it cold, and see if the accelerate pump spits some gas. Would be interesting to know !

Edited by Dartgame

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On 1/12/2017 at 1:25 AM, Don Coatney said:

Rich, that is my point. I did not use a secondary pump or other means to prime the Carburetor. When I shut the engine down several months ago the gas did not evaporate same as it did in the B&B carburetors.

Don:  My car has sat for approx 3-4 weeks since I last started the car.  I pulled the airhorn off the top of the carb on my factory B&B carb. The fuel bowel did not have any gas in the chmaber and the float was at the low point.  My inline glass AC fuel filter that is approx  3 inches prior to the input tot he needle value was still full with gas.

So you might have apoint about the stromberg carbs. Since my carb is the original it also might be from a worn gasket or bushing not sure since I have not had it professoanly rebuilt. I have rebuilt it myself.

 

So this might be something to consider doing inthe future.  Not sure if there are any stombergs that were maded to fit my car. I do not have any crossreference on Stromberg so it would be hard for my to know which is the correct carb to replace. Also   what is the coast and other modifications that might have to be made to make it work is also an unknown. So I can live witht he  priming of the carb with the electric pump. If you have any info on the Stromberg could you send it to me.

 

Thanks,

Rich Hartung

desoto1939@aol.com

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Your electric fuel pump used only for starting is a very good idea. It eliminates the long starter cranking for the mechanical pump to deliver fuel to the Carburetor. The Stromberg is on my 1948 Dodge D-24 and I believe it to be original. I have a couple of spares and they are both marked as pictured below BXVD-3.

002_15.jpg

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I rebuilt my Stromberg and aside from the leaking threaded plug below the fuel bowl, I seem to have a leak coming from slot in the middle of the carb through which the accelerator pump link comes through. Any thoughts?

 

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Here is a link to a great article on Ball & Ball Carbs and the history that Chrysler had with the Ball & Ball brothers and then they were merged with Carter.

www.allpar.com/cars/adopted/carter.html

Rich Hartung

desoto1939@aol.com

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On ‎1‎/‎11‎/‎2017 at 7:54 PM, Ricky Luke said:

Rich, those answers are probably lost to history. Maybe Chrysler Corp wanted to trial the Stromberg unit, or maybe they wanted an alternative if one or the other supplier failed to deliver for any reason. 

Rick

W.P. Chrysler was a cheep SOB.  He was very focused on price and efficiency.  In those days, the companies (Chrysler, Desoto, Dodge, Plymouth)were very distinct entities and had individual supplier histories.  Dodge had a very long relationship with strongberg. Chrysler with Carter.

I suspect that it was both price and relationship that drove a lot of decision making before 1950. 

In 1946-1947 however there was a disruption of Carter carbs due to a strike.  Chrysler shipped cars without carbs.  Then they shipped a kit to use a Strongberg in place of a Carter.  I have the technical bulletin on this in my files with the part numbers and service information.

The Strongberg is a more expensive carburetor back in the day when new compared to the Cater.

 

James

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James:  Please read the link below that explains the history between Chrysler and the Ball&Ball cater carburetor.  I was using this as input to my question. Also please note that on the Chrysler, Desoto Ply during the early years and including my 1939 Desoto they used the Ball and Ball Carb but in 1939 on the Dodge they used the Stromberg but does anyone have any documentation as to why they would use the Stromberg on the dodge which was at the third car in their series in the price range and with the Chrysler and Desoto being in the higher range. I do not have any literature as to why this occurred.

I have a carb book that shows the correct carb to use, Chrysler 1942-1962 including 6 and 8 cylinders used Cater,

Desoto 1942 - 61 used Carter except 1961 All with a 2 bore Stromberg.

Dodge 6 cyl 42-53 Strom fluid drive and standard drive and 49-53 carter. 55-58 Strom 60-62 Holley

Ply 42-62 Carter

 

Here is a link to a great article on Ball & Ball Carbs and the history that Chrysler had with the Ball & Ball brothers and then they were merged with Carter.

www.allpar.com/cars/adopted/carter.html

Rich Hartung

desoto1939@aol.com

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I rebuilt my Stromberg and aside from the leaking threaded plug below the fuel bowl, I seem to have a leak coming from slot in the middle of the carb through which the accelerator pump link comes through. Any thoughts?

 

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55 minutes ago, meadowbrook said:

I rebuilt my Stromberg and aside from the leaking threaded plug below the fuel bowl, I seem to have a leak coming from slot in the middle of the carb through which the accelerator pump link comes through. Any thoughts?

 

Any chance the float level is set too high?

 

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Checked it and it is to spec, I think I even lowered it a bit.

 

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Last started my Stromburg equipped D-24 on January 11, 17. Today March 26, 17 I elected to start it again. Only required 2 very short bursts of the starter motor with full choke and several pumps of the foot feed and it sprang to life. So once again I am a big fan of the Stromburg carburetors. My Carter B&B equipped P-15  never started this easily after sitting idle this long.

DSC01530.jpg

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