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Top Speed In Your Flattie


55 Fargo

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In my car, I can definitely beat every bicycle on the road...  and  have reached the top speed of 65 mph !  65 mph is of course the speed limit... nudge nudge wink wink.

 

I can tell you that in the passenger seat  with a driver I wont be identifying in case there are any of my law enforcement buddies listening in, we  exceeded he speed limit by more than double.  That was in excess of 130 mph as it registered on one of those new fangled gps units.   That was a Plymouth, with a few modifications to a big block. The only reason I wont spoil the surprise and disclose the speed is I expect the driver may want to post a picture I took of the gps.  I am convinced if we could have folded out wings

we could have taken off!

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I was in high school when I first got my 54 Belvedere (with 3.73 gears, stock flathead 6/3 speed, used radial tires), so it was imperative for me to find out how fast it would go.  No GPS in 1990, I just know I saw the needle past 100.  I've always said 105.  Short radial tires probably mean it was really 85 or 90. 

 

Some time after that I built the engine.  Shaved head, reground cam, ported, but still stock intake and exhaust.  I got an OD about the same time.  When I tried the top speed after all that, I was fairly unhappy that it wouldn't get past 85.  Now I realize that the transmission was set for a 4.10 gear, so I was probably over 100.

 

There are issues with the OD now, and it won't engage.  The car will still cruise easily at an indicated 65-70.  Taking in to account the speedo cable gearing, it might be doing 80 or more.  I don't drive that fast very often though, most time under 60 indicated.  Of course it no longer has the stock intake/exhaust.

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Agreed....The 217 (stock and in proper tune) will do 100+ with the 4.1 rear.

 

I've done it in Ol Bessy (37 D5 4 Dr Touring) on 495 around the NVA area back in the 90s when I was running a bone stock 54 217 in Ol Bessy......three speed and the original 4.10 rear.

 

When Dad first bought Ol Bessy he used to regularly break 100 up hill in the area of South Mountain Md going to and from the Sinoquipe BSA Camp he worked at as a counselor.

 

At that time, the engine was the original 37 Dodge 217 set up, 30 over, 60 off head, split dual exhaust, Edmonds dual intake and two Carter B&B carbs.  He won a number of races up the mountains against the V8s in the late 50s and early 60s as he could pull around on the long uphill straights still accelerating in 3 gear while the straight and V8s were downshifting to get back to their higher rpm power curve.

Edited by Sharps40
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Interesting statistics we have here,

 

4.10 diff, 28 tire 100 mph = 4919 rpm

4.10 diff 28 tire 80 mph = 3936 rpm

 

3.90 diff 28 tire 100 mph = 4680 rpm

3.90 diff 28 tire 80 mph = 3744 rpm

 

3.73 diff 28 tire 100 mph = 4476 rpm

3.73 diff 28 tire 80 mph = 3580 rpm

 

Okay this is without any overdrive, pretty high rpm values for the little old long stroke 6s.So now in modern times are we afraid to push these old beasts past 60 mph, or are we just being wiser.....

 

A local Mopar part guru, told me he once drove to Grand Beach north of Winnipeg about 60 miles or so in a 48 Plymouth, right pinned about 80 mph, said he blew the engine part way there, did not say if he threw a rod, broke a piston or spun a bearing...

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I was wondering about the high rpm factor also.  Up til now, no one has said anything about damage to their engines as a result of high speed driving.  My rule of thumb is to maintain the 80% rule.  No more than 80% of max rpm rating.

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I was wondering about the high rpm factor also.  Up til now, no one has said anything about damage to their engines as a result of high speed driving.  My rule of thumb is to maintain the 80% rule.  No more than 80% of max rpm rating.

Which is wise, so keeping under 3000 rpm would be smart, and under 2600 would be even better...

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I have run an Overdrive in most of my cars .  Back in the 60s, I could reach an indicated  100 mph

but you have to be able to steer and stop as well if you want to be around to boast about it.  As a rough guide, multiply your indicated speed by 50 running in direct drive.  This will give you approximate engine RPM   e.g..  60 (mph) X  50  = 3000 (rpm) The engine  might turn 5000 rpm, but not for long.

 

If you are using an engine like a 251 or a 230, the longer strokes make for excessive piston speed (measured in feet per mile)

but remember, in the 50s and 60s, it was our duty as young citizens to find the weaknesses in the cars our parents drove.... and I worked hard at it.  

 

 I think  nicest engine for all round sweetness is the Canadian 218, 3 3/8 x 4 1/16,   bored .060 to 3 7/16.  Lots of torque and good top end.  Mind you this is just my opinion . I have at this time  cars with 201, 218 (both USA and Canadian) 230 and 251 and each

has its merits.  Overdrive in 3 of them with 3.9 rear screw.  I can drive as fast as common sense dictates.  65 to 70 on a good highway  but my 35 Ply does not really like 60+ because of tires (600 x i6) and steering limitations. Our Plymouths were never meant to be barn burning performers, but to be safe and reliable. A 50 Plymouth driven by Johnny Mantz won the first ever 500 mile race at Darlington SC with an average speed of 78 mph. Sure there were faster cars on the field but not as reliable as the Plymouth.

My 51 convert. has a 251 bored .060 and 8.5 compression. It has run 50000 miles and recently completed a trip over several mountain passes with 100 degrees temp in the valleys.  No oil consumption, no overheating and 20 mpg.  avg speed maybe 55 mph

with top at 65. Mostly in Overdrive.   You gotta like it.

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The Canadian 218, is of course the shortest stroke, and possibly could handle a little more spinning.

I have owned 1, it was nice engine, my 251 in the fargo is nice too, have 3.23 gears, so off the line and from about 35-50 mph in 4th a little doggy...

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I think the one thing that most people fail to recognise about older cars, especially the pre '40/50 models is that they were basically designed to be ran on poor roads at the 30 to 50 mph range,

Until just a few years ago I knew a man in Eastern Idaho that had a '39 Plymouth coupe which he bought in 1940. One of his stories about the car envolved an incident that happened in 1942.. For some unknown reason "Marrion" tried to catch a south bound Greyhound bus, after driving the Plymouth for just inder fifty miles at a high rate of speed, the engine came apart. Marrion had the car towed into Pocatello to the Plymouth dealer, when the car was picked up the service manager told Marrion that he shiuld never drive the car over 45 mph again. Marrion told me that he never drove the car over 45 mph again, and he never had another problem with the engine during the next fifty plus years.

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I was in high school when I first got my 54 Belvedere (with 3.73 gears, stock flathead 6/3 speed, used radial tires), so it was imperative for me to find out how fast it would go.  No GPS in 1990, I just know I saw the needle past 100.  I've always said 105.  Short radial tires probably mean it was really 85 or 90. 

 

Some time after that I built the engine.  Shaved head, reground cam, ported, but still stock intake and exhaust.  I got an OD about the same time.  When I tried the top speed after all that, I was fairly unhappy that it wouldn't get past 85.  Now I realize that the transmission was set for a 4.10 gear, so I was probably over 100.

 

There are issues with the OD now, and it won't engage.  The car will still cruise easily at an indicated 65-70.  Taking in to account the speedo cable gearing, it might be doing 80 or more.  I don't drive that fast very often though, most time under 60 indicated.  Of course it no longer has the stock intake/exhaust.

Hi Moose -  I had to chuckle, so I will apologize up front when I saw 'I was in high school..."  and "1990" in the same sentence.  Given I had my licence before your 1954 likely rolled off the assembly line Im often out of touch with new stuff.  In this case, I learned early however maybe was older than yourself, that as soon as I started changing components like tires and rear end ratios the speedometer became at best a rumor.  When my grandson bought me a garmin for Christmas, hooked it up for me

the biggest plus for me was it accurately measured speed.  While I was suspicious at first a speeding ticket that matched the speed the garmin said I was going pretty

much confirmed it for me.

 

We can all go through the mathematical calculations  and back in the day recalibrating your speedometer was all the rage  for a few year, however the garmin

is the answer for me.  They are also so cheap now and have battery life that even if you don't run 12 volts you can use one for several hours. Spring for one and

you may be able to turn that frown upside down !  That's my 2 cents to your issue !

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By my GPS, I've had my '33 with its stock 190 cu. in. engine and 4.375 rear end up to 70 MPH. Took a while to get there and couldn't maintain it on a grade. As noted by others for their newer cars, 50 MPH is a lot more comfortable (but I do sit at about 60 MPH or a trifle above if I have to go long distances on a freeway).

 

 

 

My last few times traversing the LA metro area (in a modern car) leads me to think that the average speed on a freeway around there is closer to 35 MPH than to 80 MPH. Maybe at 2AM it gets up to 80, but not during the more normal times of the day that I've gone through there.

In the multi passenger lane were we Todd. I was chuckling. 35 mph around LA has to be in the multi-lane. I find when I visit about 3.5 mph is wide open if I am luck. That said getting lucky isn't exactly a frequent occurrence for me.

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Something I learned before I was driving age was that race car engines are rebuilt after every race, if they don't blow up or throw a rod or whuthavya...and I knew several older folks who had cars & trucks that were over 20 yrs old they never got in a hurry and they followed their maintenance charts religiously...so going fast is fun for a little while, but slow & steady wins the race :cool:

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I was wondering about the high rpm factor also.  Up til now, no one has said anything about damage to their engines as a result of high speed driving.  My rule of thumb is to maintain the 80% rule.  No more than 80% of max rpm rating.

Back when I was in high school(late 50s) and had a 1948 like the one I have now, I was headed to the girl friends house.  There was a 53 Chevy at the stop light.  Not wanting to pass up a little street race we left on the green light.  Side by side in first gear, then in 2nd I pulled ahead a bit.  I knew if I went to third he might catch me,so I just kept my foot in it.  When I turned off I heard a knock in the engine.  I knew it would not be good so I just pulled the engine.  The high RPM had jerked wrist pin right out of the piston.  The rod was still in the cylinder, with the top half of the piston at the top of the bore.  At that time I could go the the junk yard and get another good engine for $40.00  Not so cheap anymore.  I think I went over the 80% rule by a factor of 2....

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Back when I was in high school(late 50s) and had a 1948 like the one I have now, I was headed to the girl friends house.  There was a 53 Chevy at the stop light.  Not wanting to pass up a little street race we left on the green light.  Side by side in first gear, then in 2nd I pulled ahead a bit.  I knew if I went to third he might catch me,so I just kept my foot in it.  When I turned off I heard a knock in the engine.  I knew it would not be good so I just pulled the engine.  The high RPM had jerked wrist pin right out of the piston.  The rod was still in the cylinder, with the top half of the piston at the top of the bore.  At that time I could go the the junk yard and get another good engine for $40.00  Not so cheap anymore.  I think I went over the 80% rule by a factor of 2....

Top end damage, but nothing wrong with the bottom end. You probably had an issue prior to the race with that wrist pin, just waiting to let go.

Now that old stovebolt would have put that rod through the block, if he stayed in 2nd.................LOL who won the race?

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Top end damage, but nothing wrong with the bottom end. You probably had an issue prior to the race with that wrist pin, just waiting to let go.

Now that old stovebolt would have put that rod through the block, if he stayed in 2nd.................LOL who won the race?

I did.

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on some of the cars I have in storage for the ultimate 'get to them one day'  the layer of dust is what gives them a finished look...

 

Future "barn finds" !

 

Someone will pay too much for.

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on some of the cars I have in storage for the ultimate 'get to them one day'  the layer of dust is what gives them a finished look...

Dust in a barn on a top speed thread Tim, does Don have his fingerprints on your barn cars too?

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maybe two...the other have been rotated about in their parking spaces since Don was last here..I added an addition since his visit that allows for parking another 8 full cars behind locked doors.

I see a lot of dusting in your future Tim, ever though about buying a "Swiffer"?

Edited by Fargos-Go-Far
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