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Open Topic Engine Thread?


55 Fargo

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thanks Marty, that's what I am talking about. thank you. sorry for dumb questions that follow. rods ground down is that to reduce weight ?  custom forged venolias with modern Toyota rings. is there someone you can buy those ? 20 years ago I could find forged and cast pistons. Now I don't see forged and not much in cast even.

whats a torque plate ? got any pictures of your air cleaners. I cant picture them but they sound cool.

Forged pistons for an L6 'should' be available from any company that makes V8 forged pistons....just a matter of whether or not they have the appropriate sized blank to whittle on.  As Marty has done, we sometimes let the available ring package determine the actual bore size rather than using the old 20-30-40-60 o/s line of thinking.

If you get serious about using forged pistons let me know and I'll ask my supplier for a quote.

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Since I can't afford to buy all the mentioned vintage intake manifolds and dyno test them, I have found Tim Kingsbury's opinions on different intakes and performance mods to be very interesting. I didn't feel like he was hawking his wares or trying to sell me something. I hope others will chime-in and tell us about their modifications and what has been successful or a flop. Very interesting thread that I hope we keep going without the personal attacks. I'll go back into lurk mode and see what I can learn. Thanks for the great forum.

 

Scott.

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Since I can't afford to buy all the mentioned vintage intake manifolds and dyno test them, I have found Tim Kingsbury's opinions on different intakes and performance mods to be very interesting. I didn't feel like he was hawking his wares or trying to sell me something. I hope others will chime-in and tell us about their modifications and what has been successful or a flop. Very interesting thread that I hope we keep going without the personal attacks. I'll go back into lurk mode and see what I can learn. Thanks for the great forum.

 

Scott.

 

I also don't think he was promoting/hawking their (his & George Asche's) intakes, maybe just using them as examples compared to the "vintage" intakes. It seems George is "The Man" when it comes to these engines & with current technology, I don't doubt a bit they came up with better flowing/performing intakes compared to what was made some 60 years ago. While they may not have the "cool factor" as far as looks, maybe in 60 years, these will be just as sought after. I also appreciate him sharing his learned experience through testing.

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Met a guy here in Norway last summer with a -48 Dodge 3-window coupe running a turbo charged 230 cid flathead. The guy told me he works for a turbo company and installing a turbo on the flathead was the obvious choice for him. The turbo installation was done 10 years ago and has been working just fine so far!

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Met a guy here in Norway last summer with a -48 Dodge 3-window coupe running a turbo charged 230 cid flathead. The guy told me he works for a turbo company and installing a turbo on the flathead was the obvious choice for him. The turbo installation was done 10 years ago and has been working just fine so far!

wow now that is cool. don't suppose you got any more details on what he used or how he did it ?

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Met a guy here in Norway last summer with a -48 Dodge 3-window coupe running a turbo charged 230 cid flathead. The guy told me he works for a turbo company and installing a turbo on the flathead was the obvious choice for him. The turbo installation was done 10 years ago and has been working just fine so far!

There is a Plymouth Duster in the current issue of Car Craft magazine that was built by someone who frequents slantsix.org.    It is a remote turbo that is mounted just behind the rear axle with an intercooler.    With the remote  installation you can practically hide the turbocharger.   It was not intended to be a race motor, but the six has 240  percent power increase over stock.  Not many attempt to turbo a flathead six but within limits a turbo could increase mid range torque considerably without becoming destructive.

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There is a Plymouth Duster in the current issue of Car Craft magazine that was built by someone who frequents slantsix.org.    It is a remote turbo that is mounted just behind the rear axle with an intercooler.    With the remote  installation you can practically hide the turbocharger.   It was not intended to be a race motor, but the six has 240  percent power increase over stock.  Not many attempt to turbo a flathead six but within limits a turbo could increase mid range torque considerably without becoming destructive.

There have been 3 or 4 turbo charged slant six engines at Chrysler Carlisle over the years. There were two of them last year.  Not sure why he would want to put a turbo way back there,  but I best go get the Car Craft Mag and give it a read.  We have  had a turbo charger on a flathead and that is a story for another time. The one HellYeah  has posted a picture of almost looks like it may have an intercooler to it. That would definitely be cool to learn more on the build details. The turbo we had on a 4 ton truck was very simple compared to what I see in that picture and I suspect

the Norway version is a better version !   My wife and I were over in Norway a couple of years back in Sarpsborg to watch a friend who was playing Pro Hockey over there. Wished I had ran into that car, although likely wasn't the car show season.

Tim

 

 

https://store.carlisleevents.com/SearchResults.asp?Cat=26

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There have been 3 or 4 turbo charged slant six engines at Chrysler Carlisle over the years. There were two of them last year.  Not sure why he would want to put a turbo way back there,  but I best go get the Car Craft Mag and give it a read.  We have  had a turbo charger on a flathead and that is a story for another time. The one HellYeah  has posted a picture of almost looks like it may have an intercooler to it. That would definitely be cool to learn more on the build details. The turbo we had on a 4 ton truck was very simple compared to what I see in that picture and I suspect

the Norway version is a better version !   My wife and I were over in Norway a couple of years back in Sarpsborg to watch a friend who was playing Pro Hockey over there. Wished I had ran into that car, although likely wasn't the car show season.

Tim

 

 

https://store.carlisleevents.com/SearchResults.asp?Cat=26

I don't think this particular remote turbo setup looks complex (but it is). The person who built it hired a shop that specializes in remote turbos.  I think it produces 12 pounds of boost.   The remote turbos seem to work better for some motors, not so good for others.   The engine compartment does not have excess heat and can look almost stock.   The builder spent a lot of time and money with dynos and tuning,   He made 250 HP, but the mid range torque increase is really the focus.  Power is nothing that a slightly built 318 couldn't produce.  It uses a carburetor.  If it was documented so that it could be copied, I might try it, but I'd never spend that much money developing the system.

 

If the torque of a flathead could be modestly increased from 2,000 to 2,800 RPM without excess heat, then you could have better response for passing on the highway. Less need for high sustained revs. If there was a proven recipe I might try it, but so many turbos setups do things differently.  Getting everything sorted out for the average guy is so time consuming that its unlikely to have good long term outcomes, few are still going two years later.   Respect the limits and the L-head should do okay.

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Speaking of turbo flatheads, here's an ebay link (not mine or any relation to the seller) of 1 installed in a truck. Hope it doesn't get removed. If someone wants to post the pictures from the ad, have at it.

 

http://www.ebay.com/itm/131415494389?_trksid=p2060778.m1438.l2649&ssPageName=STRK%3AMEBIDX%3AIT

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The biggest oiling system improvement for our flatheads is adding a full flow oil filter.  A bit of searching should find details of the easiest method that involves drilling a couple of holes in the block above the oil pump.  I did mine differently by using a modified hydrive engine oil pump and eliminating the crossover pipe in the oil pan; my oil goes from the pump to an external oil filter and pressure regulator, then across the back of the firewall and back into the block where the original pressure regulator used to be.  My way requires modifications to the block, the oil pan and the oil pump, and doesn't gain much over the less complicated way of doing it.

 

50plymouth had asked for details on the rest of my engine.  I think the only stock parts in it are the crankshaft, the lifters and the valvesprings.  The rods are stock ones that have had the sides ground down, polished and balanced.  The pistons are custom forged 9 to 1 Venolias using a modern Toyota ring set.  The block was bored to piston size using a torque plate that we made for it.  All of the ports in the block were smoothed out and matched to the gasket size.  It has bronze valve guides with cut down Chevy V-8 valves for both intake and exhaust.  The cam is a mild regrind, the head is a polished Edmunds.  Intake is a polished Edmunds with Carter-Weber carbs on Stovebolt adapters with a homemade air cleaner based on an O'Brien Trucking top cover.  The throttle linkage I made using an extruded aluminum mount with pillow bearings and anodized aluminum arms.  Exhaust is handled by a set of cast iron headers into a 2 inch dual exhaust system.  ignition is the Stovebolt HEI.  I've no idea of actual horsepower, but I'd guess at maybe 150 or so.  It's a fun drive, and I love the reactions I get when people see it.

 

Marty

 

Hey Marty,

Did you make the bronze guides out of blanks? Or start with something similar? I'd like to eventually make a set. The iron guides available these days come with too big ID's so you're boowin' oil from the start. Plus iron/stainless ain't the best combo.

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Hey Marty,

Did you make the bronze guides out of blanks? Or start with something similar? I'd like to eventually make a set. The iron guides available these days come with too big ID's so you're boowin' oil from the start. Plus iron/stainless ain't the best combo.

We used the bronze inserts where you use a special tap to put threads in the stock guides, then screw the insert in and lock it in place.

 

Marty

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We used the bronze inserts where you use a special tap to put threads in the stock guides, then screw the insert in and lock it in place.

 

Marty

 

Ah, that makes sense. Did you do this in-block?

 

As far as performance, bronze guides are an important part. Cooler running valves, very little wear, and reduced friction.

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Ah, that makes sense. Did you do this in-block?

 

As far as performance, bronze guides are an important part. Cooler running valves, very little wear, and reduced friction.

Yes, we did it in the block, then put in new valve seats, then did a valve job on the whole thing.

 

Marty

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Here's mine. A slightly hopped up 230 intended for performance and a daily driver. I drive this thing almost daily, and on the freeway all the time. about 10k miles on it so far, and very dependable. Big increase in power over the previous version, especially on the low end. I can climb hills in OD now.

 

Originally a 218 rebuilt in 2009, but kept eating the rod bearings. Turned out the rods were not honed properly, the crank had a bad grind on it, and the crank was cracked on top of that. Was a 1941 crank.

 

So got a 230 crank and new rods, and had a very nice grind job done on it by Armando of Custom Crankshaft Repair.

Bored .060" over.

Coated pistons

3-angle valve seat cut

Ported intake/exhaust passages

Chevy valves

ARP studs and nuts on everything

Blueprinted and balanced everything

Align honed mains

George Asche intake, carbs, and linkage

Tom Langdon's Air cleaners

Pertronix ignition

 

Future plans are to install Langdon's cast iron headers with dual exhaust, along with electric fuel pump. Also better ignition wires.

 

 

 

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Pics of the crankshaft. Armando took his time, but he got the journals perfect. Look at those radii at the edges...

 

.010" / .010"

 

I paid extra attention to getting the right clearances on all the bearings. These engines were assembled "tight" from the factory, and tight rod clearances are especially critical for longevity due to the offset.

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Here's mine. A slightly hopped up 230 intended for performance and a daily driver........

 

 

John was brave enough to let me drive his truck through town AND on the freeway. lol

It's an awesome truck with plenty of power...its a Mopar Muscle Truck! 

 

It's also worth noting That Marty won "Best L-6 Engine" "Best Modified Engine" at the 2013 Clements Tailgate BBQ, and John won the "Best L-6 Engine" at the 2014 Clements Tailgate BBQ.

 

In other words...in a crowd of L-6 enthusiasts, they were recognized! ^_^

 

48D

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Thanks Tim!

 

That was the previous version of the engine too, might have to let you take it out on a Brandt-88-Clements Road loop for comparison this spring!

 

I'd be happy to take it to Bonneville, John.....Thanks for offering!

I'll enter it in the same class as my 408ci 500HP V8...

I know it'll hit the big numbers with me driving it! :lol:  

 

48D

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