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Halogen 6 volt headlights


BobT-47P15

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I bought a pair of halogen 6V headlights at O'Reilly Auto Parts for the 47 Plymouth.

Made by Wagner.  Part number H6006.....marked on the light, but not on the box.

They call it an "off road light".

 

When I mentioned this light earlier, someone said--is the current draw and wattage

too much for our old wiring system?  I found this discussion on a Jeep CJ2A forum.

Apparently a person was wondering if the halogen was OK for his 1948 Jeep.

 

From the information copied below, it sounds as if the halogen is an OK replacement

for the standard incandescent bulb.

 

The person who started the post said:   On the back of the headlamp is printed:   WAGNER H6006 DOT    6V  45   10.      Its 3 prongs line up exactly as the old bulb, but the new bulb's prongs are a bit shorter.  

 

I went to the Wagner site and it can not find the H6006.

 

 

A second poster said:

----My initial 2 conclusions:
1)   From a amp-draw standpoint it is safe to use a Halogen 6006 (H6006) as long its watts rating is roughly the same (~40-50) as the Incandescent 6006 (I6006).  My understanding is that  WATTS = VOLTAGE X AMPS.   If true then a 50 watt Halogen and a 50 watt non-Halogen draw the same amperage.   
2)  From a  heat standpoint it is also safe to use the Halogen with same watts rating.   The Wagner tech said that Halogen technology generates less heat per watt and the Sylvania engineer said it generates about the same amount.  I think a typical Halogen bulb gets so hot because its heat is  focused on its relatively small bulb and it is why the bulb gets so hot. 

 

In the case of these sealed beam 6006s, when you look inside the halogen Wagner 6006 I bought yesterday you can actually see the small separate little halogen bulb.  Since it is within the confines of the large 7" sealed beam housing, there is a lot of space and beam housing to spread/absorb the heat so my thinking is that the sealed beam housing gets no hotter than an equivalent wattage Incandescent's housing.   When you look into the old Wagner I6006 you can actually see the regular filaments laid out just like you would see them in a cars' brake or turn signal bulb.

-----WAGNER'S (Federal Mogul) tech-provided product specific information today:  Their 6006 (incandescent) was replaced by their H6006 (halogen) and the 6006 is no longer made.   There are no potential negative ramifications to using their H6006  versus the  I6006 in our CJ2A application.   Max amp draw on high beam: 8.2       Max amp draw on low bean:  6.2

-----Sylvania"s tech and engineer provided product specific information today:  Tech was a nice guy but all he could see about their 6006 is that it was 6 volt and that High Beam listed as 50 watt and Low Beam listed as 40 watt.  He couldn't tell if it was Halogen or not and put me on hold and checked with his engineer and when he came back said the engineer couldn't tell either.  Left him with a bunch of things to research and he called me back later with feedback:  Their 6006 is an incandescent and they do not have a Halogen equivalent.   Watt high beam 50 and watt low beam 40.    Amp high beam 8 and amp low beam 6.5.

 

Another poster says:    35 watt is the low beam, would draw less that the 40 watt standard bulb, but the 65 watt hi-beam would draw 30% more than the standard 50 watt hi-beam. ie 10+ amps each.

 
Another said:
 
The "Off Road Lighting" gave me pause.  Some lamps have higher wattage hi-beams (60-80-100 watts), in which case you might need heavier gauge wires.
 
Re. the "quadratech" lamps:
quote_box.png ... In conclusion, what seems left out is LUMENS (~visible light).   A halogen generates more visible light per watt than an incandescent, so a smaller wattage halogen (say 35 watt) could generate as much light as a larger (say50 watt) incandescent while drawing less amperage (easier on the old 6 volt generator?) and generating less heat (longer bulb life?)

 

So, still not totally sure about current draw, at least on high beam.

Edited by BobT-47P15
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I think the other question is what is the rating on the voltage regular that you have in your car.  My 39 Desoto still has the 6v gen and the old regulator which is rated at 28 volts.  I spoke to a builder that makes the 6v alternators and he siad that if running the halogen lights he suggest the 65 watt generator.

 

So I would think that using a generator only then might give some extra draw on the system.  Not a expert on this topic.  So if ywould think if converting to halogen then might also convert to using an alternator also.

 

Rich HArtung

desoto1939@aol.com

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most likely the only cause for the OFF ROAD USE only was the very cut of the lens design and the manner in which if shaped its forward projected beam..this had to meet DOT approval and was the very reason that imported cars brought into this country had to be converted to approved lighting long ago..of course..that standard is basically out the window these days.   As for the amperage, your original 6 volt wiring will handle the load even if the output wattage is a bit higher, however my concerns are the very load withing the small contact patch of the light switch itself...even with the age of these cars and factory switches. I highly recommend that you take the load off the H/L switch and run it through a single relay using the dimmer switch as the directional device high/low in operation as it is meant to be from the factory..remember this..you have two head lights..if you are running 45 watts on each bulb that is 90 watts combined and at minimal output of 6.8 voltage from the gen you will draw through the H/L swithch some 13.23 amps and you still have not added in the current draw of the dash lamps, running lights etc that is supplied and routed through the H/L switch fuse or CB...

 

so yes wattage is wattage and voltage is voltage and old parts are just that .....OLD

 

putting the relay between the H/L witch and the dimmer switch with aux input from the battery through a proper rated CB or fuse will allow you to retain 100% clean original wiring look of the front terminals mounted on the rad support...

Edited by Plymouthy Adams
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Hmmmm, do you have a voltmeter or something that measures volts/amps/ohms? You can hook the headlamps up and measure the current draw of each the incandescent and halogen and see how they compare. Can use the battery if you are concerned about the wiring, just measure the voltage first to help calculate the watts (battery's can be higher/lower than 6v). Can use the ohm values to determine the high/low/common pins, but do not use these values to determine wattage, since the ohm value increases as the filaments are heated. Best to remove all doubt and test yourself or condition your electrical system to accept more demanding headlights (as mentioned above). If you do determine wattage, you can then cross reference this value with the gauge of wire running to the lamps, and the potential load on the rest of the system.

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On a P15 an easy way to lower the load through the headlamp switch is to re power the stoplight/s so they do not pass through the headlamp switch. Just make up a fused wire from the battery side of the starter solenoid, out through a 15/20 amp in line fuse and drop it down to the hydraulic switch. This will depending on how you have your rear light wired ( I have all three wired for brakes) put that load on the independent circuit rather than through the headlamp switch. Its not a great deal, but if you think about sitting at a long traffic light with you foot on the brake pedal and the headlamps/tail lamps/dash light on, those extra amps out of the circuit could contribute to cooler connections all through the circuit. Plus it make you brake lights that much brighter as they aren't sharing power with the rest of the system.

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That would be great for my D24, as there is only one brake light. Where would one find a 6V LED brake light bulb that would interchange?

 

TIA

 

Some good information and ideas on this thread. I'm thinking that it might be nice to have a couple of halogen driving lights on the front bumper, wired independently of the other lighting systems, for those times when you just aren't seeing well.

 

ken

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  • 3 months later...

I tried the 6 volt LED type bulbs, and in my opinion they aren't worth the money.  They really aren't any brighter, and tend to only emit light in a very small arc, unlike the halogens. Even the old style incandescents work better.  I wound up using a 50 cp halogen in the original center brake light, and using two vintage auxillary stop lamps with 20 cp halogens mounted on the rear bumper just below the tail lights. Gives me plenty of lights when applying the brakes, and no issues with overloading the circuit. I can post a pic if anyone is interested.

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Brake lights can be made brighter and draw less current without any wiring changes by exchanging the incadescent bulbs for LED bulbs.

Ok, how do you just change the bulbs with LED if you car is still positive ground? LEDs only allow current in one direction. I tried that and the LED did not come on. Unless you can reverse the bulb socket connections.

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there are more than one led maker out there..try these if you wish...read the specs sheet, by the verbage, they will work for your positive ground

 

http://www.ebay.com/itm/6-six-volt-1154-LED-tail-brake-stop-light-socket-dual-contact-bright-bulbs-HP-/161254303712?pt=Vintage_Car_Truck_Parts_Accessories&hash=item258b8167e0&vxp=mtr

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I installed LED brake light bulbs several years ago and no longer have the info for where I bought them. However, Plymouthy is correct, bulbs are available that will work on 6 volts positive ground. I have an LED center light and LED combination tail and brake lights. My directionals are separate lights that were added by the previous owner; this simplified my installation. To make the LED bulbs work with directionals requires a change of the flasher unit.

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  • 1 year later...

I bought a pair of halogen 6V headlights at O'Reilly Auto Parts for the 47 Plymouth.

Made by Wagner.  Part number H6006.....marked on the light, but not on the box.

They call it an "off road light".

 

When I mentioned this light earlier, someone said--is the current draw and wattage

too much for our old wiring system?  I found this discussion on a Jeep CJ2A forum.

Apparently a person was wondering if the halogen was OK for his 1948 Jeep.

 

From the information copied below, it sounds as if the halogen is an OK replacement

for the standard incandescent bulb.

 

The person who started the post said:   On the back of the headlamp is printed:   WAGNER H6006 DOT    6V  45   10.      Its 3 prongs line up exactly as the old bulb, but the new bulb's prongs are a bit shorter.  

 

I went to the Wagner site and it can not find the H6006.

 

 

A second poster said:

----My initial 2 conclusions:

1)   From a amp-draw standpoint it is safe to use a Halogen 6006 (H6006) as long its watts rating is roughly the same (~40-50) as the Incandescent 6006 (I6006).  My understanding is that  WATTS = VOLTAGE X AMPS.   If true then a 50 watt Halogen and a 50 watt non-Halogen draw the same amperage.   

2)  From a  heat standpoint it is also safe to use the Halogen with same watts rating.   The Wagner tech said that Halogen technology generates less heat per watt and the Sylvania engineer said it generates about the same amount.  I think a typical Halogen bulb gets so hot because its heat is  focused on its relatively small bulb and it is why the bulb gets so hot. 

 

In the case of these sealed beam 6006s, when you look inside the halogen Wagner 6006 I bought yesterday you can actually see the small separate little halogen bulb.  Since it is within the confines of the large 7" sealed beam housing, there is a lot of space and beam housing to spread/absorb the heat so my thinking is that the sealed beam housing gets no hotter than an equivalent wattage Incandescent's housing.   When you look into the old Wagner I6006 you can actually see the regular filaments laid out just like you would see them in a cars' brake or turn signal bulb.

-----WAGNER'S (Federal Mogul) tech-provided product specific information today:  Their 6006 (incandescent) was replaced by their H6006 (halogen) and the 6006 is no longer made.   There are no potential negative ramifications to using their H6006  versus the  I6006 in our CJ2A application.   Max amp draw on high beam: 8.2       Max amp draw on low bean:  6.2

-----Sylvania"s tech and engineer provided product specific information today:  Tech was a nice guy but all he could see about their 6006 is that it was 6 volt and that High Beam listed as 50 watt and Low Beam listed as 40 watt.  He couldn't tell if it was Halogen or not and put me on hold and checked with his engineer and when he came back said the engineer couldn't tell either.  Left him with a bunch of things to research and he called me back later with feedback:  Their 6006 is an incandescent and they do not have a Halogen equivalent.   Watt high beam 50 and watt low beam 40.    Amp high beam 8 and amp low beam 6.5.

 

Another poster says:    35 watt is the low beam, would draw less that the 40 watt standard bulb, but the 65 watt hi-beam would draw 30% more than the standard 50 watt hi-beam. ie 10+ amps each.

 
Another said:
 
The "Off Road Lighting" gave me pause.  Some lamps have higher wattage hi-beams (60-80-100 watts), in which case you might need heavier gauge wires.
 
Re. the "quadratech" lamps:
quote_box.png ... In conclusion, what seems left out is LUMENS (~visible light).   A halogen generates more visible light per watt than an incandescent, so a smaller wattage halogen (say 35 watt) could generate as much light as a larger (say50 watt) incandescent while drawing less amperage (easier on the old 6 volt generator?) and generating less heat (longer bulb life?)

 

So, still not totally sure about current draw, at least on high beam.

So Bob, what did you finally end up with and how are they working?  I'm consider switching to halogens, but don't want to run into a can of worms.

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On my old 64 and 65 C10s I converted to halogen headlights.

 

Simply drew power direct from the battery to the lights via a 30 amp self resetting breaker with a 30 amp relay wired in, one for high and one for low.

 

The headlight and dimmer switch were then only seeing the amps necessary to activate the relays. 

 

In testing the performance, the factory wiring allowed 10.5 of the available 14ish volts to get to the original sealed beams....since everything was routed thru the dash and switches.

 

Once the load was controlled by switches and routed more directly to the lights, volts at the light socket of the new halogens were 14 to 14.5, full power.  Both the sealed beams and halogens were significatnly brighter when all the losses were countered by removing the swiches from the main feed.

 

A similar set up would increase performance of original 6v  bulbs or the 6v haongens. 

 

In addition, its less load on the single ammeter fuze of the 30s cars so those that see the headlights always burning out the ammeters fuze would likely have no more trouble in that area.

Edited by Sharps40
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Pretty simple wiring job and 99% of the load disappears off your old or small contact/low amp switches.....headlights of every/any kind will be lots brighter since they draw full battery/gen/alt power instead of what is left over after a high resistance trip thru the harness, dash, ignition, switches and out to the lights.   Prolly under $100 total from oriellies/etc and that includes the hi temp silipuddy headlight connections for the hotter halogen sealed beams, etc.

 

Luck.

 

I forgot to mention, those still stuck with 6 volt cars will need to, naturally, purchase and use 6 volt relays. Bosh and others make relays in 6 volts/30+ amps.   {You can try a 12 volt relay but function in a 6 volt system may be hit or miss as the power down function of the 12v relays is often 6 volts or so! (i.e. a 12 v relay might work okay at 9 or 10 volts but at 6 its powered off)}

 

Final bits....if you purchase 5 pin relays, I believe it is Terminal 87A that is NOT used. 

 

As for polarity, shouldn't matter.

 

 

1ovfVkJ.jpg

Edited by Sharps40
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I have heard that the 2357LL taillight bulbs are brigher than the norma 1157. I plan to buy a pair when I get my car back from the upholstery shop to see. 

2357 brighter for the brake/turn filament. Tail filament probably same lumens/c.p.

Edited by shel_ny
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  • 1 year later...

I know this is way way ling post - but having read everything I am still wondering: Is it now recommendable to change to a halogen set-up? After all standard 6 Volt lights are often very dark. And is there really a need for a different wiring set-up? thanks

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I recently added some 6 volt 35 watt halogen fog lights to my car. I ran separate wiring with an inline fuse and a dedicated switch. The lights worked very nice when tested, but when I went to go for a ride both bulbs blew within 5 seconds with the car running. My assumption is my regulator was set above the threshold of the possibly cheap halogen bulbs as I do not have problems with my regular bulbs. 

I put some 12 volt 35 watt halogen bulbs in the fog lights and the are working fine just not as bright as the 6 volt did. But they are good enough to act as the daytime running lights that I installed the lights as.

So check your regulator output before your run the halogen. 

Also try new regular 6 volt headlights first as I heard they tend to get dimmer over time

Edited by 1949 Goat
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  Our car is a 6v negative ground, and I installed halogen sealed-beams in is a few years ago. They work great—brighter, with less amperage draw, and the polarity is a non-issue. Further, I rewired the car about that time with a harness from Ron Francis Wiring. No problems whatsoever . . .

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