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That Long, Sporadic, Occasionally Embarrassing 1949 Windsor Build Thread Plymouthy Adams Expects


GlennCraven

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The 1949 Chrysler Windsor I checked out and started a long and winding thread on earlier this spring -- and finally bought in late June -- emerged from the seller's storage building onto a rollback today. After several weeks of regular rain, today we finally had time, clear weather and solid ground to drive the big truck into the country yard and grab the car.

 

The Windsor is largely complete, minus drivetrain. The original Spitfire Six was apparently junked for being stuck beyond saving. The Fluid Drive and trans went to the scrapper with it.

 

I picked up a built 360 and 727 Torqueflite from a salvage auction on July 13. A swap kit from Butch's Cool Stuff will facilitate the installation. The salvage owner is a longtime local restorer and rodder with a good reputation. He and his team, who own welding equipment and an engine hoist I presently do not, are going to handle the swap, though I will be there to get my hands a little dirty and learn from them. ... There's a chance I'll be moving fairly soon (all the way to New York if it happens) and the project would be a bit easier to take along with the drivetrain in it rather than on a pallet, so we're going to get this done.

 

If I stay here, I'm going to enroll in evening division auto body classes at the local technical school. I wanted to do some auto shop and body classes while in high school and was talked out of it by counselors who figured that sort of thing was for people who wouldn't leave our little town and go to college. ... Anyway, the vo-tech is great about having students bring personal vehicles into the shop to put their lessons to use. That's where I saw the old Dodge pickup I pictured in a Pilot-House forum thread.

 

This car will need more body work than I first believed. Once I removed all the seller's junk stored in it -- Christmas decorations, kids' old school projects, parts for at least three other cars, jug after jug of various vehicle fluids, a bunch of tools, etc. -- the floors are a lot more rusty than I assumed from the portions I could see prior. I already figured on replacing the trunk floor because the most visible rust on the exterior is below the trunk sill and low in the rear fenders, and cleaning out the trunk certainly confirmed that.

 

I've added a bunch of pics to the Photobucket album. But here's one to show her fully in the daylight for the first time in awhile. Progress will be posted here. Probably too infrequently on progress and too verbose in description.

 

20130907_104745.jpg

Edited by GlennCraven
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It doesn't look rusty to me,but the first place you want to look is under that chrome trim running along the bottom.

 

As for the rust ot at the bottom of the trunk lid and below the taillights,I think that was standard equipment when the car was new.

 

Is your padded dash still complete?

 

IMHO,these things have beautiful dashboards.

Edited by knuckleharley
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Totally agreed on the wheels. They won't survive long once the car is roadworthy. I have several ideas about that, from some of the Wheel Vintiques offerings to what I can dig out of a semi-private Mopar salvage yard in central Missouri where a guy has a slowly dwindling stack of police rims and a storage bin full of center caps.

 

Officially I suppose this body style is known as the 1949 Chrysler Windsor Club Coupe.

 

There's some rust peeking out from under that left front chrome accent, some in the fender wells, and some in the passenger rocker/door sill for sure besides in the floors and trunk and low in the tail.

 

If I move to New York, it will be Troy.

 

Oh, and the pad is buggered up on the dash, but the rest of the dash is extremely nice. The wheel has only one crack and the center insignia looks great. The dash, gauge cluster, wheel and shift/turn signal levers were what really drew me in on this car. Made me want to see how nice the rest of the car could be.

Edited by GlennCraven
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Hi, Mark. ... It's really more south-central, closest to Springfield but north of there on the way to Jeff City.

 

I have (or had?) an address that if you put it in a GPS would probably only get you lost. He had to come into town (Buffalo, Mo.) and meet us at the McDonald's to follow him out there. ... I do have a phone number for the owner, who is pastor of a very small church he's put on the same property. I'd give you that in a PM if you want. Not that I want to hide it from the rest of the board, but a lot of people might not want their number out on a page that can be Googled.

 

Most of what he has is 1960s and '70s. It's all stuff he started "collecting" when he was just a teenager. Quite a few A-, B- and E-body cars and parts strewn about in tall grass, scrubby trees and deeply rutted paths. Many parts piled in box trailers or stored inside dead vans, etc. Engine blocks, transmissions, whatever, just sitting on rocks or pallets around the property. Stacks of hoods and trunk lids. A couple of late-60s and/or early '70s pickups, one in particular that looked fairly solid. An occasional non-Mopar vehicle. He's built tents over a rebuilder or two. High prices on some of it, for sure, but the cop car wheels were $50 per rim and $10 per choice of cap and I probably should've bought four of each on principle because I've seen what they go for repainted on eBay.

 

He was a very nice guy in his mid- to late-40s. Took us around in his 4x4 because it had rained recently, though it was close to 100 degrees and muggy the day we were there in June. We still almost got stuck.

 

A lot of it has been outdoors a good while -- he moved and was still moving this "collection" from about 30 miles away to this spot! -- and I know he's unloaded some things via Craigslist that were good, usable parts. But there's still a lot there to gander at (an experience in itself for me) or pick through, especially if you knew just what you wanted (because he may know exactly where it's at) or if you have a very good eye for the rare and valuable things that can be saved from a Mopar hulk.

 

So if anyone wants the phone number, PM me and I'll PM it back.

Edited by GlennCraven
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  • 2 weeks later...

So, engine swap under way and predictably we hit a roadblock right off ... though not really the roadblock I would have expected.

 

It looks like we're short two small but necessary pieces from the Butch's Cool Stuff engine mounting kit. I've placed a call to customer support to see if I can get them in short order.

 

I should've taken photos of all the parts as they came out of the box. Maybe I can still get a few shots before they're on the car, especially since we'll be waiting for a couple of bits.

 

(Edit: I should add that all the parts we did receive from Butch's Cool Stuff are of exceptional quality and appearance. Very professional work and finish. ... I would, however, be interested in rewriting and editing their instructions, which are usable enough but could be a lot slicker, slightly condensed and more organized.)

 

Pictured are the 360/727 unit in full dangle, with the waiting Windsor in the background.

 

20130919_130153.jpg

 

 

And, I like a former owner's answer to a heater ducting issue. That's a 1982-84 era Indiana license plate, halved, crimped and screwed together.

 

 

20130919_130234.jpg

Edited by GlennCraven
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Thanks, but if you do come over, don't look too close. She's got more rusty bits than I realized when I gave her the once-over (and twice-over) in the seller's shed. I'm glad that most of the sheet metal I'll need seems to be available from Rock Auto and probably elsewhere: Floor pans, trunk pan, rockers. I've even seen solid fenders on eBay (billed as NOS, but they've been sitting around corroding a little) for $195 each.

 

Maybe it isn't as bad as I fear. And she certainly isn't as rusty as she could be for a 64-year-old car; both of the guys working on this engine install for me made such comments today.

 

I didn't realize you lived in this general region. I should really drive to YOU and learn from YOUR work! It would be like going to trade school for a semester.

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Hah! I don't know about that but you're more than welcome anytime. How far are you from Kansas City? I'm about 5 hours from there.

From here the body looks decent and almost any 40s two door coupe is worth saving.

Edited by falconvan
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I agree on saving the oldies. Even the four-doors, if they're halfway solid and you want to take the grandkids for a ride.

 

I live right on the Oklahoma line, about 70 miles north of Tulsa. Its close to six hours from me to you, but would make a good three-day weekend trip with St. Louis included. Provided I don't accidentally bump into the ex-wife in the big city.

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Boy, that trip could get expensive quickly!
 
:(  :rolleyes:  ;)

 

Doug

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So, engine swap under way and predictably we hit a roadblock right off ... though not really the roadblock I would have expected.

 

It looks like we're short two small but necessary pieces from the Butch's Cool Stuff engine mounting kit. I've placed a call to customer support to see if I can get them in short order.

 

Is that your garage? That's a pretty impressive place for a guy that's a newbie to car work!

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Is that your garage? That's a pretty impressive place for a guy that's a newbie to car work!

 

Nooooo ... it's the shop at the salvage yard where I bought the engine/trans combo. And just a small part of it. They were dismantling two pickup trucks in a separate room to the right in this picture, the office is to the left, and if you pass by the car there's a door to a lot of indoor storage with shelf after shelf of parts.

 

It's run by a good guy and he has good help. Once they get this welding done and the engine and transmission speared in, I can take the car wherever it needs to go and start on the rest.

 

The girlfriend didn't get the job in New York and now she's being courted by Janesville, Wisc. I've always enjoyed visiting Wisconsin but don't have much desire to live there.

 

Last week I pulled a Chris Rock, dropped the mic and walked off stage at my job after the owner broke a fundamental agreement with me. I'm going to see what's available around here and elsewhere. (So if anybody is in need of an experienced communications or media relations person, I'm available.)

 

On the swap note, I got ahold of Terry at Butch's Cool Stuff on Friday. He was not in the office but answered my voicemail/email with a call and promised to send out the missing parts Monday morning with priority shipping. The customer service was super; he's even throwing in a T-shirt. ... So thumbs-up to Butch's Cool Stuff. 

 

Meanwhile, I'm planning to address the 12-volt upgrade in one swell foop (as an old newspaper coworker used to say) with a Painless 12-circuit universal street rod harness. That's what Painless tech support recommended and it's a very comprehensive yet comparatively inexpensive kit, about $350 from several vendors. It's all the wiring I need if I don't plan power windows, locks or accessories, but is enough to run a modern radio and air conditioning if I get a Vintage Air unit later. Since I love the period design and layout of the dash and its components look so good, I plan to retain the original gauges, so I'll need to reduce the voltage to those in addition to replacing bulbs and such. ... Any tricks there or things I should be sure not to overlook?

 

All-new brakes including Rusty Hope front discs are a necessity.

 

Speaking of tricks, the trickiest thing might well be fashioning a shifter linkage for the 727. I want to retain the factory column shift lever from this original Fluid Drive-equipped car and I'm not sure exactly how that's going to work. So anybody with ideas, I'm all for hearing them.

 

P.S. Just ordered a reprint shop manual on eBay for about $21 plus shipping, under $28 total. Usually they're $29 to $32 plus shipping, either on eBay or from sellers on Amazon. Looking at a Hollander's interchange guide that covers this era, but is a Chrysler parts book just as good and cheaper? ... The Hollander book is about $60.

Edited by GlennCraven
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"Since I love the period design and layout of the dash and its components look so good, I plan to retain the original gauges, so I'll need to reduce the voltage to those in addition to replacing bulbs and such. ... Any tricks there or things I should be sure not to overlook?

 

All-new brakes including Rusty Hope front discs are a necessity.

 

Speaking of tricks, the trickiest thing might well be fashioning a shifter linkage for the 727. I want to retain the factory column shift lever from this original Fluid Drive-equipped car and I'm not sure exactly how that's going to work. So anybody with ideas, I'm all for hearing them.}

 

I'm the wrong guy to ask about that. I like all the original dash trim on my P-15,too,so I just had a custom digital setup made that fits in the original instrument cluster "bucket" and everyting shows through the chrome dash "windows" just like the original gauges did. The difference is they are digital,and the whole thing looks like a polished dark stone when the switch is off.

 

oon4.jpg

 

You can't see them in this photo,but the turn signal lights,brake warning light,aod lockup light,high beam light,and cruise control lights are also built in. They don't show until they are activated.

 

I haven't checked the prices,but I suspect it is cheaper to today to convert to disc brakes than it is to buy new drums and rebuild the original brakes.

 

As for hooking up your column shifter to the 727 that shouldn't be a problem. You can probably use the 727 shift rod and adapt it to attach to either of the shift arms on your column. Lots of people did this back in the 50's before all these floor shift kits became available. The only drawback is you don't have a gear indicator to show which gear you are in.

Edited by knuckleharley
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while a certain maker of aftermarket parts says yes to a set of indicator for the gears on anything out here.their setup for the 727 was pure hokum and I asked them to change their write up to reflect that as it was less than advertised and I admit they did listen to me and nodded in agreement, I have not looked back to see if they changed the write up of the product..but kits are out there

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That's a sweet custom digital dash, and a great idea to show through the factory locations. I could see doing that if the gauges in my car were in poor condition. But they look so good!

 

I did see a gauge cluster like mine on eBay, missing some of the gauges and others weren't very presentable. That would be a great candidate for refurbishing and adding your sort of digital insert, in a car probably more customized or "rodded" than mine is likely to be. I'd probably be more likely to do that with a project that started out rougher or less complete. ... That buggered-up cluster was ridiculously expensive though. I think the seller wanted over $300.

 

On the shifter, I figured on not having a gear indicator, which is a bit inconvenient. And I'm not experienced with mechanical matters (of this sort anyway) so I'm not sure how everything goes together and is actuated. I may be making the process more complex in my mind than it really is.

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Gear position indicator?

 

A few ideas for you: ;)  Sorry i cannot upload the type of files that I'd saved on the desktop. :mad:

Oh well, the sites I searched are: watsons street works and ronfrancis wiring. Both carry gear positon senders and dash indicator led lights. R> francis makes one just for the mopar 727 trans.

 

Also Search- gear position indicator on the web. Lots of sellers, utube videos,pics etc.

 

Doug

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Tim,

went back and reread Your post- Did not then nor now see a name mentioned, otherwise I would not have broght up his name( r.francis) as their does seem to be plenty of others now makeing them and the other mentioned is a electronically adjustable to match the trans and has a neutral/ park start  only feature.

Like I tried to imply do your own research- not suggested any one product.

 

Doug

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I've seen some indicators available, including digital indicators in chrome finish that could be perhaps fixed low on the dash. ... I'll look around.

 

Linkage-wise, I suppose a good place to start would be to wait until my shop manual arrives this week or early next, look at the exploded views of the shifter and linkage for a factory transmission setup from 1949, and go from there at adapting something to a modern automatic rather than a vintage three-speed with fluid drive.

 

Thanks for the ideas.

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